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Prisoners of Google Android development

solutional.ee

201–210 of 318 posts

Re: Prisoners of Google Android development

#201
post #60

These minimum SDK requirements have been known for a very long time. It's correct that the email only got sent recently, but the requirements are usually announced 2 years in advance in this manner: After 0 days: New Android version comes out After 1 year: App Updates need to target the latest Android version After 2 years: Apps can't be downloaded on devices with the "new" Android version anymore unless they target…

Many companies, institutions, public bodies hire external contractors to do a one-time development of a limited-scope app. I bet a bunch of them have their Google Play Console dev account email read by people in some engineering infrastructure function who know nothing about Android development. Updating their apps now means an internal scramble and unexpected project costs. Not saying its wrong or that we shouldn't…

There's nothing "unexpected" about a process that takes 2 years to enforce restrictions and has been communicated and has been in place for years.

Re: Prisoners of Google Android development

#202

I don't get the comments tearing into OP. Sure, he could have been more careful. He could have tested the login on the latest version of Android. But what if it wasn't a login crash? What if it worked on the latest version but not others? At what point do you draw the line? At some point, you just have to say "OK this is a platform used by literally millions of apps and millions of developers, and mistakes will be ma…

> What if it worked on the latest version but not others? At what point do you draw the line?

This is a poor excuse. Even if it were a web app, you would still need to test on multiple browsers.

Doing a smoke test on a new release is just basic professionalism.

And having a phase roll out with a rollback is also not a new concept.

Re: Prisoners of Google Android development

#203
Kudos to that user reporting the issue, sometimes when I report issues I am 90% no one read those.

> There's nothing we as developers can do to speed up the reviewal process nor contact Google support in any way. There are no possible workarounds and we just have to wait. Wait until we're excused to put our fixes to production.

A couple years ago, and out of self-learning process, I decided to develop an Android app, never did any smartphone app development, Flutter was new so got excited to try it out, long story short, I submitted the app to play store, and it remained “under review” for 40 days! Just like OP, Next day I was checking the dashboard, silly me thinking the process is smooth, after 3 days I stopped checking and later forgot about it until they sent an email after 40 days, I pulled the app later and decided never to touch anything again with smartphones app development, and that was play store, supposedly the easier one after reading some horror stories of the App store.

Re: Prisoners of Google Android development

#204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’ve been writing software for 20 years and never had to update an app for a new operating system version?

Not with a deadline (aka Windows). I usually work on the backend and/or front end (Web). This is a pretty new world for me.

And you have also never had a security vulnerability in one of your dependencies causing you to update your software? A new database version? A new version of whatever runtime you were using?

Re: Prisoners of Google Android development

#205
"First idea was to roll back to the older working version in the Google Play Store so that only users who were running latest Android and had the latest version of the app would be affected and then deal with that problem in a proper way at the next day. For my surprise I found out that this is not possible - there is no way using Android eco-system to pull back or cancel latest release."

Perhaps this is an example of "anti-rollback technology".

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37218265

"I personally have been against developing mobile apps for years now for the exact same reasons described in here and other similar articles - as soon as you decide to develop mobile apps then you give control of your product/service away to a third party, which you can't replace when problems happen."

What is an "app store". Computer owner cannot install any software they want on their own computer. Computer owner must select from pre-approved list provided by third party. The word "store" is misleading. 95%+ of the programs in the "store" are free. If the figure 95%+ is incorrect I apologise; I can get the exact figure. This has been publicly disclosed in litigation.

These concepts can seem outrageous to anyone who has watched computer and internet use go from uncommon to common. There are HN commenters who want to pretend they are totally organic and perfectly fine. Hypernormalisation. Beyond question. Right.

Maybe for those who were born into a world where computers and the internet are being dominated by a handful of online advertising services companies calling themselves "tech" companies, ideas like

(a) "you cannot use a previous version of this software that you got for free or paid for; an advertising company will protect your privacy" and

(b) "you must select from the following software chosen by an advertising company to run on your computer"

are an easy sell.

Those born into this hypernormalised environment are actually a minority of the population in the USA. For example, 66% were born before 1999.

https://www2.census.gov/library/publications/decennial/2020/...

We can change this "anti-rollback" and "app store" BS. (All falsely justified in the name of "security" and/or, ironically, "convenience", two mutually exclusive concepts.)

The personal computer belongs to the person who bought it. They can use any software they like, any version they like, and they can write their own software to run on their own computer, without any payment to a third party. This was once where things were before the so-called "tech" companies threw a monyewrench into the wheels of progress.

Re: Prisoners of Google Android development

#206
post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just have no desire to have an app. The attempt to download one when I visit a website is unwelcome.

That's what's pretty great about PWAs: 1. For people like you that don't want to install them, they're just a normal website. 2. For people that do want to install them for the added functionality (things like notifications), then it is easy to install, and furthermore cheaper for developers to build and maintain (one codebase instead of multiple). You say "you have no desire to have an app", but I think for most peo…

I think they are talking about popups to install apps everytime you visit (reddit).

Re: Prisoners of Google Android development

#207
post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just looking through the apps I currently have open… Bank app, chat app, maps, Tile, YouTube and a weather app. Only one of them is actually doing anything that wouldn’t fit a PWA. So why are they apps, not a collection of links?

I would say only the weather and bank apps would be really equal as a PWA. Maps require complex gestures and advanced graphics and UIs that would never work well as a PWA. Try maps.google.com. Its nothing like the Google Maps app. Plus Android Auto integration. Tile probably needs pretty deep Bluetooth integration and background processing that the web doesn't provide. YouTube can do things like PiP that you can't do…

PiP, the one feature of youtube that I did not want (in the majority of cases) but got anyway.

edit: Sorry for the snark. I think that maps are probably doable with pointer events (https://caniuse.com/?search=pointer) and Android is doing pretty well in terms of Web Bluetooth https://github.com/WebBluetoothCG/web-bluetooth/blob/main/im...

Re: Prisoners of Google Android development

#208
post #34

While I concur with the author on the challenges of Android development, the author made two major mistakes. One, he didn't test his app on the latest version of Android. This a very major mistake and the reason why we keep 11 virtual machines around with all the versions of Android that our app is supported on. Two, when you release an app on Google Play, you never, never, never deploy the app to 100% of your user b…

This feels a little victim blaming. Those two things shouldn't be an issue at all.

Re: Prisoners of Google Android development

#209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you target SDK If you target SDK Both have extensions available to Nov 1. Wear has different thresholds. Hopefully https://support.google.com/googleplay/android-developer/thre... helps clarify too.

Ah, okay now I get it. However out of 30 clients, we also have one app receiving no warning at all.

Who is on 31

Re: Prisoners of Google Android development

#210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's just that most users really have separated in their minds (not surprising due to history) that apps come from app stores, and the browser is used for websites. Right, because for a very long time (and maybe still) PWAs have been much closer to terrible websites than good apps. They generally don't have the same UX properties as real apps. Remember when the iPhone first came out and web apps were the only optio…

> And if it's just a web site, why do you need to "install" it? A link is surely sufficient? The point is that there are apps that can pretty much be built entirely using web technologies as PWAs, but in doing so they are no longer "just web sites" and they need functionality of installed apps, like notifications. For example, most banking apps on Android could be entirely rewritten as PWAs, but they'd need to make u…

Both of these features are available in browsers these days.
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