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66% of Americans say they want extended European-style vacation policies at work

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Re: 66% of Americans say they want extended European-style vacation policies at work

#151

Post by winternewt »

badpun wrote: post #88
kramerger wrote: post #14

It has been shown that you need around 14 days of interrupted rest to recover from stress etc. The European laws are not some random thing we made up because we are lazy. It is to ensure workers are well rested and ready for a new working year. Hence in long term it will also benefit employers. Some personal anecdata: I notice an immediate difference when I come back after a long vacation. The first 2-3 months I work…

> It has been shown that you need around 14 days of interrupted rest to recover from stress etc. Do you have sources on that? My anecdotal experience is that I need at least 3 weeks.

Agreed. The first week you're winding down, the last week you're winding up. So with three weeks you get one week of quality restorative vacation.

Re: 66% of Americans say they want extended European-style vacation policies at work

#152

Post by quonn »

lqet wrote: post #143
quonn wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here is a realistic estimate for Munich. A room costs minimum 350 Euros or may easily cost 1000. Food and going out costs at least 100 Euros or healthy food 200-300. The subway ticket at that time cost 70 per month. There are some additional costs such as health insurance etc. Tuition at that time was 500 per semester for me. Spending a semester abroad as is common is usually far more expensive. And by law your paren…

> And by law your parents have to pay. You are not required to even work. That may be true in theory. In practice, many parents are in an income range which makes the child not eligible for educational support (Bafög), but which also does not allow supporting the child with 1000 EUR/month. The thought of telling my parents "you are required by law to send me more money, do it!" never occurred to me. They had a house…

Well. I‘m just telling you what is required by law. In some sense the fact that you feel like they could not easily pay the costs just supports what I was saying. Namely that it is a cost not be neglected by saying „oh it‘s free here“.

Re: 66% of Americans say they want extended European-style vacation policies at work

#153

Post by Mordisquitos »

nxm wrote: post #82
cloogshicer wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. I live in a big European city. You basically don't need a car - pretty much anything within the city is reachable in about 30min, and public transit is comfy. Also, I have a public transit ticket that allows me to travel the entire country for a year, which only cost about 1000€. Yes, salaries are lower, but I also don't have to save anything to get my kids through university, or keep emergency funds for hea…

Salaries are lower and taxes are significantly higher. Take your pick, but I’d rather take the American approach of a more dynamic job market. I wouldn’t want to deal with low GDP growth, public strikes (see France) and little ability to build wealth.

What are your personal challenges in dealing with low GDP growth? I myself have found no need to deal with low GDP growth when it is happening.

Now what I wouldn't like to deal with is with lack of paid holidays, having to deal with masses of insurance paperwork and co-payments in case I need healthcare assistance, or deal with running out of sick days over the course of a year if I'm unlucky.

I suppose with enough wealth I wouldn't need to worry about the problems above, but I believe very few Americans have succeeded in that regard under their system. So, I prefer to stick to the generally European approach of protecting the basic rights and wellbeing of all our citizens, and will strike to defend it if necessary.

Re: 66% of Americans say they want extended European-style vacation policies at work

#154

Post by unmole »

dopidopHN wrote: post #24
momirlan wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

and taxes...

I pay a month worth of salary per year in France and I pay the same in Louisiana. 1/12 But in France you get something out of your taxes

What's the VAT rate in Louisiana? /s

Re: 66% of Americans say they want extended European-style vacation policies at work

#155

Post by Moldoteck »

nwoli wrote: post #61
kramerger wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can have private medical insurance or retirement funds on top of that. One does not exclude the other. In fact, most employers offer that as part of your benefits What you refer to is basically lowest level safety net.

Walkable cities, better culture, etc. Not just safety net

In California you can get a somehow walkable city, live there for 5-10 years and save enough to retire in eu with own home and pension. How many years an eu citizen (me) should work in avg dev salary to buy a home/3 bdroom apt?

Re: 66% of Americans say they want extended European-style vacation policies at work

#156

Post by rpadovani »

quonn wrote: post #99
rpadovani wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uhm, what? If you live with your parents, and the university is free, where does that number come from? And if you don't live with your parents, you live with others students, spending 600-1000 euro month for living, how do you reach that numbers?

Bachelor + Masters is 10 semesters usually. 1000 * 12 * 5 = 60.000. Well in the range that I quoted. And depending on the city the actual costs can be more.

Ah, but then your first comment is highly misleading, because when you talk number, readers assume cost per year.

You are basically saying that living in Europe in a university city cost anything between 6000 and 20000 euros each year.

Maybe a bit high, but I think I can agree.

But living is a cost all around the world, and universities in Europe add a very low overhead on top of it, while universities in US can easily triple your cost of living, so I still don't see your point

Re: 66% of Americans say they want extended European-style vacation policies at work

#157

Post by lordnacho »

ubercore wrote: post #66
unmole wrote: post #6

Did the survey ask if they wanted a pay cut to match European style wages?

Anecdote time, but I moved from a decent (non-FAANG) tech salary in the US to a (locally) good salary in Norway, and feel better off as a result. In outright terms my salary took a huge hit, but there are so many little things in the US that eat up your money you don't realize over time. And the difference gets even more stark if you have children.

This is what I don't get about the US system. You can get paid a lot of money, but it is unthinkable for someone with a good job in America to not send their kids to college, which costs a heck of a lot of money. 2.5 kids is going to cost many years of earnings to put through college, and you don't even know what amount that is since the price is flying away.

In Norway you can have 10 kids and all they have to do is be diligent about doing their homework, and they will get into university.

Re: 66% of Americans say they want extended European-style vacation policies at work

#158

Post by quonn »

n_ary wrote: post #103
quonn wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Parents have to pay for university in Europe unless they are poor. And while there are no fees, the costs are typically between 30k and 100k per child. edit: In Germany. I‘m German and I have studied there. I should know. edit2: Someone said this comment could be interpreted as the cost per year which is not the case. This is the total cost.

> edit: In Germany. I‘m German and I have studied there. I should know. I am also there and I didn't pay any monies anywhere for university(unless you mean fancy private university?). All state universities are free and we only paid some misely amount every 6 months for the city-ticket(free access to all public transport in the city, cool stuff). Also, state pays each child ~125/month until they are 25. I believe you…

Good for you. I paid around 70 per month and it only covered the subway network between my apartment and the university. Or whole network for 85. That‘s not exactly cheap.

Re: 66% of Americans say they want extended European-style vacation policies at work

#159

Post by pydry »

nxm wrote: post #82
cloogshicer wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. I live in a big European city. You basically don't need a car - pretty much anything within the city is reachable in about 30min, and public transit is comfy. Also, I have a public transit ticket that allows me to travel the entire country for a year, which only cost about 1000€. Yes, salaries are lower, but I also don't have to save anything to get my kids through university, or keep emergency funds for hea…

Salaries are lower and taxes are significantly higher. Take your pick, but I’d rather take the American approach of a more dynamic job market. I wouldn’t want to deal with low GDP growth, public strikes (see France) and little ability to build wealth.

I think this is what John Steinbeck meant by a working class that sees itself as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.

Re: 66% of Americans say they want extended European-style vacation policies at work

#160

Post by quonn »

nevon wrote: post #128
quonn wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I said in my comment it has nothing to do with tuition fees.

Then what exactly is your point? That people require money to live? My parents spent exactly $0 on my education, as every student gets a grant of around €3000/m, and you can get a low interest student loan for the rest.

Which country? I should have clarified that I‘m talking about Germany which is certainly part of Europe. And for sure nobody here gets 3000 per month.

In Germany students receive no grant (other than the regular Kindergeld for children) unless their parents together earn less than 40k before taxes.

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