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Fewer university students are studying Mandarin

economist.com

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Re: Fewer university students are studying Mandarin

#91

Post by mensetmanusman »

MissingAFew wrote: post #80
tjpnz wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would I want to travel somewhere where the government thinks I, as a person from "the west", am the literal embodiment of satan? On a more personal note I've had a family member recently return from living in China. Harassment from local law enforcement had a large part to play.

I'm sorry your family experienced that but that is not the norm, to be frank. ...Literal embodiment of Satan? What? You do realize they don't follow Christianity right? Nonsense. Overblown exaggeration.

It’s a figure of speech. Possibly poking at the fact the CCP is scared enough to be tearing down mosques/churches all over?

Re: Fewer university students are studying Mandarin

#92

Post by porknubbins »

samcheng wrote: post #29
jimbob45 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have an explanation for China’s low tourism? Is it just latent fears of COVID?

I doubt it's about COVID now. The government has really ruined China's "brand" internationally. 1. You need an onerous-to-obtain visa to visit. There is no visa exemption. 2. Banking is a total pain for a foreigner. Many places only accept Alipay or Wechat, which require a Chinese bank account. Cash doesn't work well either, because the largest denomination is tiny. 3. Many US-China flights were canceled in the pande…

How about China running concentration camps in Xinjiang, making China tourism morally similar to visiting Nazi Germany or Soviet Russia.

Re: Fewer university students are studying Mandarin

#93

Post by hakfoo »

jamesaurichs wrote: post #79
yongjik wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if the signs in China are not translated into English TODAY Could you give me an example? I just Googled "beijing airport sign" and everything seems translated as expected, e.g., Gates, Beijing Capital Airport, International Departure, Drinking Water, etc. I assume you don't mean you want Beijing written as "North Capital"?

https://sg.news.yahoo.com/beijing-replaces-english-words-sub... The English word “station” was replaced with “Zhan,” which is the pinyin or romanised version of the Chinese character. In some places, station names such as Olympic Park and Terminal 2 of the Beijing airport were changed to “Aolinpike Gongyuan” and “2 Hao Hangzhanlou”. https://www.economist.com/china/2022/04/13/why-china-is-turn... Why China is turning…

This seems like a better choice for the sake of "compatibility".

Given that English is not a major local language outside of Hong Kong, I'd expect there's a very high chance that an English-only speaker might need to interact with a Chinese-only speaker. It could be something like trying to relay their goal to a taxi driver or delivery person, or something as critical as trying to gain the attention of emergency services (I'd assume if you called the equivalent of 999/911 and shouted a location in the phone, even if you couldn't explain further, that would be enough to trigger a response)

Providing the English speaking audience the Pinyin gives them a chance to be understood in that situation. The translated only name is more likely to be unrecognized by the lisstener.

It doesn't seem so bizarre when you go into the Montreal metro and the signs say "Gare Bonaventure" instead of "Bonaventure Station", and that's in a country where English is nominally a supported language.

Re: Fewer university students are studying Mandarin

#94

Post by mensetmanusman »

fn-mote wrote: post #9

I can't understand this impulse. It seems blindingly clear to me that the international influence of China is rising and will continue to rise, and the need for Mandarin-English bilingual work will continue to skyrocket. If you do not believe that China is going to be an even more massive world power in the coming decades, then I guess I understand the drop in interest. I just cannot fathom how that could happen, tho…

Their population is set to drop about 500,000,000 by 2100, and they have scared away investors with the imprisonments. Also, destroying your own tech sector in the name of ideology means they aren’t super interested in the people.

Re: Fewer university students are studying Mandarin

#95

Post by zeagle »

MissingAFew wrote: post #70
samcheng wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I doubt they would do that to an average schmuck like me, but the fact that it's a common consideration shows how far the Chinese government has fallen in the international public's perception. It's a shame, too. China has some really great cultural sites, substantial natural beauty, cosmopolitan cities, and excellent and varied cuisine. It would be a great tourist destination under a different government.

It's not a legitimate consideration though.

I gave you two specific, recent examples of Canadians who were in China and arrested in response to Meng Whanzhou being held for extradition to the US. While she was living in a mansion they were in jail with 24 hour lighting, daily questioning for hours, and being denied to consulate officials. I'm not against China or making a political statement about their domestic policies, but I'm not oblivious to foreigners having no rights there or recourse which is certainly not the case here. As a Canadian the other frustration is this was really a US-China spat and Canada was immaterial.

Re: Fewer university students are studying Mandarin

#96

Post by porknubbins »

talloaktrees wrote: post #76
MaxwellKahn wrote: post #41

As an American born person with some Chinese heritage, it's interesting to see this trend play out in myself alongside wider society. When I was growing up, my parents and relatives would constantly try to convince me to learn my ethnic language, half to know my roots and half to catch the "China train". In university, I took it upon myself to take Mandarin courses for several years, but only got to middling competen…

I'm not ethnically Chinese but I studied Mandarin in college in the early 2000s then moved to Taiwan for almost a decade. I don't regret doing it, but it didn't provide me any sort of business or career advantage like everyone thought it would in the early 2000s

People never looked at the need for foreign language with enough granularity. For example there was never and real large demand for Westerners to communicate with mainland China. We send specs, they manufacture them. China doesn’t really do FDI here. Now there was a time language skills were a major plus in law or finance in Hong Kong, but I’m not sure about that anymore. The new US TSMC plants might have some needs but probably won’t have trouble filling them.

Re: Fewer university students are studying Mandarin

#97

Post by trentgreene »

hakfoo wrote: post #93
jamesaurichs wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://sg.news.yahoo.com/beijing-replaces-english-words-sub... The English word “station” was replaced with “Zhan,” which is the pinyin or romanised version of the Chinese character. In some places, station names such as Olympic Park and Terminal 2 of the Beijing airport were changed to “Aolinpike Gongyuan” and “2 Hao Hangzhanlou”. https://www.economist.com/china/2022/04/13/why-china-is-turn... Why China is turning…

This seems like a better choice for the sake of "compatibility". Given that English is not a major local language outside of Hong Kong, I'd expect there's a very high chance that an English-only speaker might need to interact with a Chinese-only speaker. It could be something like trying to relay their goal to a taxi driver or delivery person, or something as critical as trying to gain the attention of emergency serv…

I don’t have a dog in this thread’s particular fight and am basically just doomscrolling on a Friday night.

But I don’t think English is a nominally supported language in Quebec. IIRC all of Canada outside of Quebec requires dual signage in english + French, but Quebec only requires French. I’d guess Gare bonaventure is an artifact of that law rather than a translation strategy.

Re: Fewer university students are studying Mandarin

#98

Post by MissingAFew »

mensetmanusman wrote: post #87
MissingAFew wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not even true anymore, I recently bought a ticket for 1100. They don't cost 5k to 10k.

My end shows $4-9k economy, $10-12k premium.

On what time frame? I bought one for around February. Maybe if you are buying same day it's that expensive?

Re: Fewer university students are studying Mandarin

#99

Post by _tik_ »

jamesaurichs wrote: post #11

There is 0 reason to learn mandarin if you're doing it for travel/business reasons In Taiwan street signs do mostly have English translations. A lot of citizens speak English, especially night market vendors. You'll also have a lot of native English speakers in Taipei due to expatriation from US and Canada. In Singapore signs officially are in English. And it's one of the four official languages, which means most peo…

Which part of Taiwan did You visit? I visit Taiwan yearly. Only those night vendors served tourist area speak basic English. Futher away from Taipei my English less useful. Doing business with English is painfully slow. I dont speak Mandarin I usually rely on my basic Taiwanese dialect.

In Malaysia it is depend on which part of Malaysia. Not all Malaysian Chinese can speak Mandarin. Certain part speak Cantonese or other dialect.

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