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As a Haskell developer, this was hilarious! Thanks for the laughs.
I'm not sure I follow, could you expand for non-Haskell developers?
http://steve-yegge.blogspot.com/2010/12/haskell-researchers-...
I see why you were confused.
The second one's just wrong. You wouldn't use `flat_map` for that if you didn't want indentation, you'd use `Enumerator#product`:
def all_flavors
flavors = [:vanilla, :chocolate, :strawberry]
containers = [:cone, :cup]
toppings = [:sprinkles, :nuts, :fudge]
flavors.product(containers, toppings).map { |flavor, container, topping|
["a #{container} of #{flavor} ice cream with #{topping} on top"]
}
end
As someone that has also written haskell for about a decade and moved away from it as a breadwinner recently (but for other reasons - I simply wanted to filter job offerings based on social utility rather than language stacks), I definitely agree with the author's first point: the Haskell community values learning extremely strongly. That's great because you work with curious people that have always something to teac…
Python's mess of dependency and venv management system is probably equally bad, although my experience was that Poetry is decent.
By contrast, Ruby tooling usually works well (you can choose between chruby, rbenv and rvm, but they all work similarly, and Bundler just works(TM)), and Java has its warts but one of the best IDE experiences I've ever seen. Maybe the refactorings aren't as safe as in Haskell, but they're extremely easy to do.
If I had to choose the three big factors that contributed to my gradual loss of interest in Haskell, they were these : * the stylistic neophilia that celebrates esoteric code but makes maintenance a chore * the awkward tooling that makes working with Haskell in a day-to-day sense clunkier * the constant changes that require sporadic but persistent attention and cause regular breakages Valid points. Back in 2010-2012,…
In a doomed attempt to escape the prison in which they were locked, the inmates defiled their language and adopted grotesque rituals inspired by the light they saw through the bars of narrow windows. They created an endless pit of suffering of their own, which is made tolerable only because the light shafts are too high for them to see the colors created by light on trees outside.
Those that came from outside quickly lose sanity, constantly being by torn between a dialect adapted to self-imposed darkness, and a dialect that could thrive in the light but is stiffled there.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
> lamentations about bad tooling I think it's less about linters and more about basic tooling for toolchains, dependencies, cross compiling, lsp, etc... compare the Haskell tooling to Rust tooling and it's easy to see how deficient it is. > Backwards compatibility is simply a design aspect, not some holy commandment you must adhere to all times. It's also something that has enormous influence on industry adoption. I…
Sure, it might help with industrial adoption, but the more you commit to backward compatibility, the more mediocre your language becomes. (You can't really adapt new things if you have to keep everything around.) What's the point in creating the N+1th generic blub language?
I discovered it around the same time, and it was my go-to language for years and years. I had a brief stint where I wrote it professionally too, but nothing serious.
Eventually I really really got going in the industry and had to use other technologies, namely TypeScript and others. I became pretty fond of those, after getting over the initial hurdles, and didn't really spend time using Haskell at all.
After a while away, I went back to it. One time for a job interview, too. It just .. really lost its shine for me. It just all felt like such academic, ivory tower circlejerk. The ecosystem is still relatively small, the packages in it not always great and almost always have only a single or a couple of maintainers. There are still things missing from the Haskell ecosystem that people wanted over a decade ago. Hell, things like Streaming are still barely a solved problem. There are still popping up new libraries to solve it, and each does more arcane things than the previous in some attempt at getting streaming to be nice, type-safe while also not leak memory and what have you. Most of these end up leaking GHC-isms into their code.
For the most part, I've just taken what FP or Haskell has taught me to other language. Use the type system(but not too heavily) to help maintain your invariants at compile-time. Write small, pure functions as much as you can and compose them to build more complicated functionality.
I've still sort of kept on top of how haskell has been moving, and it seems to me that a lot of Haskell shops have dropped it as well. I think many may have moved to Rust. I don't see myself ever using it for anything serious again. I would much rather use Rust and get much better DX and performance while still being able to write mostly functional code.
As someone that has also written haskell for about a decade and moved away from it as a breadwinner recently (but for other reasons - I simply wanted to filter job offerings based on social utility rather than language stacks), I definitely agree with the author's first point: the Haskell community values learning extremely strongly. That's great because you work with curious people that have always something to teac…
As someone that has also written haskell for about a decade and moved away from it as a breadwinner recently (but for other reasons - I simply wanted to filter job offerings based on social utility rather than language stacks), I definitely agree with the author's first point: the Haskell community values learning extremely strongly. That's great because you work with curious people that have always something to teac…
"I also… don't really want to deal with them on a day-to-day basis. My personal experience has been that very often these sort-of-experimental approaches, while solving some issues, tend to cause many more issues than is apparent at first." This one really hits home for me
As someone that has also written haskell for about a decade and moved away from it as a breadwinner recently (but for other reasons - I simply wanted to filter job offerings based on social utility rather than language stacks), I definitely agree with the author's first point: the Haskell community values learning extremely strongly. That's great because you work with curious people that have always something to teac…
Without much direct experience of cargo I can't say whether that carries across, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was genuinely the best of breed and stays that way.