Why bumblebees love cats and other beautiful relationships (2021) • Hacker News Board

Re: Why bumblebees love cats and other beautiful relationships (2021)

#101

Post by 2ICofafireteam » Mon, Aug 21, 2023, 9:55 PM UTC

agloe_dreams wrote: post #38

dillydogg wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know you specifically asked about rats but domestic cats are killing machines. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23360987/ We estimate that free-ranging domestic cats kill 1.4-3.7 billion birds and 6.9-20.7 billion mammals annually.

This. Domestic cats are some of the most specialized killing machines in nature. Everything is raw murder machine. Massive muscle to weight ratio, optimized for extreme agility. 30mph top speed blows the doors off nearly anything it may encounter in nature. Tail allows for balance while running. Able to jump multiple times its own height. Able to fall a multiple of it's jump height. 20 built-in claws also act as tool…

You made the sale.

Re: Why bumblebees love cats and other beautiful relationships (2021)

#102

Post by nullc » Mon, Aug 21, 2023, 10:07 PM UTC

jojojaf wrote: post #69

agloe_dreams wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. Domestic cats are some of the most specialized killing machines in nature. Everything is raw murder machine. Massive muscle to weight ratio, optimized for extreme agility. 30mph top speed blows the doors off nearly anything it may encounter in nature. Tail allows for balance while running. Able to jump multiple times its own height. Able to fall a multiple of it's jump height. 20 built-in claws also act as tool…

I think the fact that they are generally well fed and well cared for compared to wild animals makes a big difference as well

The fact that we feed them breaks their equilibrium with their prey. Normally a predator starts running out of food as it wipes out its prey, but not domestic cats. And not just pets, we also feed the ferals.

Re: Why bumblebees love cats and other beautiful relationships (2021)

#103

Post by dredmorbius » Mon, Aug 21, 2023, 10:15 PM UTC

thfuran wrote: post #13

VoodooJuJu wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My cat is good at killing birds, chipmunks, bunnies, and mice. I doubt she could deal with a rat - probably too big.

Where do you live that rats are bigger than rabbits?

The Norwegian rat (a/k/a brown rat, of Black Death fame) grows up to 28 cm (11 in) long, and weighs 140 -- 500 g (4.9 -- 17.6 oz, just over a pound).

Some individuals might be the size of adult rabbits of smaller species, certainly of juveniles.

Re: Why bumblebees love cats and other beautiful relationships (2021)

#104

Post by hn_throwaway_99 » Mon, Aug 21, 2023, 10:19 PM UTC

twic wrote: post #57

dillydogg wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know you specifically asked about rats but domestic cats are killing machines. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23360987/ We estimate that free-ranging domestic cats kill 1.4-3.7 billion birds and 6.9-20.7 billion mammals annually.

You missed a crucial bit of the abstract (my emphasis): > We estimate that free-ranging domestic cats kill 1.4-3.7 billion birds and 6.9-20.7 billion mammals annually. Un-owned cats, as opposed to owned pets, cause the majority of this mortality. From the text of the paper, "majority" means 69% for birds and 89% for mammals. Feral cats kill a lot of animals, because that's what they eat. Pet cats do not. "Domestic ca…

Not quite sure I understand the point you're trying to make, because getting back to the original question, though, "Are modern cats even that good at killing rats anymore?" - the answer is yes, absolutely.

There is no real genetic difference, as a total population, between feral cats and cats owned as pets. Absolutely, as you point out, owned cats who know they'll get fed inside will murder outdoor animals just for fun, and they don't need to eat them to survive - but that's a learned behavior, nothing they were bred for. You take a normal tabby and leave it to have its litter outside, unowned, and those cats will turn into feral cats.

Many animal rescue organizations have developed "Barn cat programs" for feral cats. These cats have not been socialized to be around humans so they make bad pets, but they're happy to live in a barn and ensure it says rat-free: https://www.austinpetsalive.org/programs/barn-cat-program.

Re: Why bumblebees love cats and other beautiful relationships (2021)

#105

Post by aniken » Mon, Aug 21, 2023, 10:35 PM UTC

In appreciation of the irony:

“Humankind's common ancestor with other mammals may have been a roughly rat-size animal that weighed no more than a half a pound, had a long furry tail and lived on insects.”

Source: https://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/08/science/common-ancestor-o...

Re: Why bumblebees love cats and other beautiful relationships (2021)

#106

Post by __s » Mon, Aug 21, 2023, 10:36 PM UTC

jack_pp wrote: post #2

Are modern cats even that good at killing rats anymore? Haven't we mostly bred cats that have very rarely even seen a rat their entire life?

My parents are taking care of my cat while I'm away. Little black cat. They let me know she killed a bat that'd gotten into the house last night. Woke them up. She's an indoor cat

Re: Why bumblebees love cats and other beautiful relationships (2021)

#107

Post by euroderf » Mon, Aug 21, 2023, 10:43 PM UTC

wilburTheDog wrote: post #86

jboy55 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The last cat I had that was allowed to go outside was a fearsome mouser, delighted in toying with them and was quite the biology teacher, showing off their inner anatomy to us kids. However, birds mercilessly teased him as he had no clue how to catch one, surrounding him while he lay on the grass, chirping, then flying just far enough away when he'd move towards them.

A neighbors cat was being harassed by a bird once. It would dive bomb the cat then fly away quickly. It did this multiple times while I watched. The cat got tired of it after a while and stood perfectly still. The bird swooped down toward it and, just as it was close enough, the cat leapt in the air twisting its body upside down mid leap and grabbed the bird from the air. It was the first time I saw how a normal cat…

Seagulls hang in the air at the Helsinki market square, opportunistically snatching french fries and ice cream and such from tourists. It has occurred to me that any person as focused as that cat could lunge and grab one of these winged vermin out of the air. I myself would not try it because I'd be afraid of losing an eye to a panicking bird with a quite long beak.

Re: Why bumblebees love cats and other beautiful relationships (2021)

#108

Post by euroderf » Mon, Aug 21, 2023, 10:46 PM UTC

jakubmazanec wrote: post #44

jack_pp wrote: post #2

Are modern cats even that good at killing rats anymore? Haven't we mostly bred cats that have very rarely even seen a rat their entire life?

As others said, the hunting instinct is ever present in cats. Our indoor-only cat is always hunting flies or moths; the flies are very fast, but she manages to catch them under her paw, and play with them before eating them. Sometimes the fly escapes, but the cat catches it again.

And there's that phenom where the fly is buzzing loudly in the cat's mouth and the cat is not really crunching down on it yet.

Re: Why bumblebees love cats and other beautiful relationships (2021)

#109

Post by euroderf » Mon, Aug 21, 2023, 10:48 PM UTC

prmoustache wrote: post #26

uncletaco wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve come home to a rat body missing its head and even letting my indoor cats into the backyard might yield a dead bird or lizard on the kitchen floor.

kitchen floor? you are lucky. Some cats will offer you the dead birds on your bed.

The inspiration for the horse head in The Godfather ?

Re: Why bumblebees love cats and other beautiful relationships (2021)

#110

Post by euroderf » Mon, Aug 21, 2023, 10:51 PM UTC

angiosperm wrote: post #66

yomlica8 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bumblebees always seemed pretty docile in my experience. Come to think of it, I can't recall ever being stung by an actual bee. Asshole wasps are another story.

The best thing to do about wasps involves a vacuum cleaner.

Went on a wasp jihad as a teenager. Waited til dusk, hit all the nests with bug spray, used a stick to knock'em into coffee cans, added gasoline and torched'em up. Oddly satisfying.