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Conferences are inadvertently excluding many attendees from foreign countries

arunraghavan.net

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Re: Conferences are inadvertently excluding many attendees from foreign countries

#51

Post by resolutebat »

ggm wrote: post #17

If you're an American university with a teaching or research Reactor, make sure your conference organisers know attendees from China, Iran, Cuba, Venezuela, Syria may be required not to be within a statutory minimum distance. It's hugely confronting and embarrassing for invited speakers, paper authors to arrive and then get excluded and escorted off campus.

The four designated State Sponsors of Terrorism are Cuba, the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea (North Korea), Iran, and Syria, and due to OFAC sanctions you'll need to be very careful if you plan on inviting any of these to the US. However, China and Venezuela are not on this particular shit list.

https://www.state.gov/state-sponsors-of-terrorism/

Re: Conferences are inadvertently excluding many attendees from foreign countries

#52

Post by ghaff »

yarpen_z wrote: post #39
ghaff wrote: post #22

Something else to be aware of--which I've heard second hand--is saying anything that implies you'll be in the country to work. This can potentially include an honorarium, travel expenses covered, etc. Just something to watch. (As a US passport holder) attending conferences in most countries, much less answering some emails, without a specific business visa has never been an issue for me personally, but it can be an i…

I travel on a B1/B2 visa for conferences. When asked for the purpose of my visit, a common follow-up question is if I am going to receive any remuneration for my talk. It's a tricky question since sometimes speakers receive a reimbursement for travel costs. I imagine that answering "yes" might cause you a lot of headache.

A lot of countries (e.g. UK) seem not to have the clear B1/B2 separation that the US has with just a "standard" visa for US citizens and others covering routine business matters like attending conferences, meeting with customers, doing some work in your hotel room, etc. in addition to tourism stuff.

But you're right. No one really wants to hear about your travel expenses being covered or your nominal honorarium--which are absolutely routine for certain types of industry roles. Your company is covering it as a routine matter (and that applies if you're in business for yourself as well.)

Re: Conferences are inadvertently excluding many attendees from foreign countries

#53

Post by murphyslaw »

niea_11 wrote: post #26

> in the US, whether you are permitted to enter and how long you may stay are determined by the person at the border I don't believe this is specific to the US. The agent at the border always has the last decision on whether you can enter the country even if you have a valid visa and travel documents.

I've also noted that issue. I know of several people at my former job who traveled to the San Jose office and were turned back for some inane reason that had never been an issue before that time. US Border Guards have extreme latitude and they seem to like their power a bit too much.

Problem is that a single rejection forces you to go through the Visa process instead of the Visa-free process for the rest of your life: one of the questions on the entry form is (or was) "have you ever been denied entry", next to "are you a nazi war criminal" (not a joke). And answering "yes" on the former guarantees a whole lot of pain. If you answer "no" you're committing a felony.

The USA's entry system is inane, utterly dependent on the person in front of you and downright scary to me.

I've known conferences to move outside the US for this kind of reason, the pain was just too much and too many people couldn't get in.

Re: Conferences are inadvertently excluding many attendees from foreign countries

#54

Post by Xylakant »

lynx23 wrote: post #20

Or, even better, don't accept invites from U.S. based conferences, and you will never have any unexpected issues. Best not to cross their borders at all.

The same applies to European conferences for essentially everyone not from Europe/US, with very few exceptions.

Re: Conferences are inadvertently excluding many attendees from foreign countries

#55

Post by duxup »

ggm wrote: post #36
duxup wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> may be required not to be within a statutory minimum distance Of the entire university? What universities have this policy?

Can't find any documentation. Was an iranian engineer whose paper was accepted and they were then escorted off campus. Maybe it was some point of confusion or during heightened tensions US-Iran because I can't find any confirming documents online. The most likely situation is an over cautious interpretation of https://ofac.treasury.gov/sanctions-programs-and-country-inf...

I’ve never heard of this happening the way you describe it.

US Universities often have many international students. Public universities often are large open public spaces. It seems highly unlikely it would happen just because of the person’s country of origin… all by itself.

Re: Conferences are inadvertently excluding many attendees from foreign countries

#56

Post by josephg »

niea_11 wrote: post #26

> in the US, whether you are permitted to enter and how long you may stay are determined by the person at the border I don't believe this is specific to the US. The agent at the border always has the last decision on whether you can enter the country even if you have a valid visa and travel documents.

Border guards in the US tend to be more strict than other countries though. I’ve heard plenty of stories of friends being refused entry into the US, and I don’t personally know of anyone who was rejected coming in to any other country.

It’s devastating when this happens because not only are you thrown out of the country on the next flight, but once you’ve been rejected at the border once, you can never apply for a simple online visa permit again. For the rest of your life you need to go to a consulate with your passport like this article describes.

I was almost denied entry once when I visited Hawaii. The immigration officer heard I was on vacation for a month and had no cash on me (who travels with cash?). Turns out he was worried I’d end up homeless. He didn’t realise that as an Australian, I get paid while on vacation and I had plenty of money in a bank account online.

This isn’t (just) a race thing. I’ve heard plenty of rejection stories from white, Australian men.

Re: Conferences are inadvertently excluding many attendees from foreign countries

#57

Post by resolutebat »

lynx23 wrote: post #20

Or, even better, don't accept invites from U.S. based conferences, and you will never have any unexpected issues. Best not to cross their borders at all.

Visa processing for third world nationals isn't much better in the EU or the UK, although at least appointment waiting times are usually not measured in years.

Re: Conferences are inadvertently excluding many attendees from foreign countries

#58

Post by murphyslaw »

xiaomayi wrote: post #37

This post might be a little biased since the author holds an Indian passport. He tend to blame the conference organizers to help Indian people to organize the transfer (VISA talking) to their conference. The thing I'd like to suggest to conference organizers is to set up an online mirror that might be used for people that, temporarily, can't get a VISA. If you blame conference organizers for some stupid rules about V…

Why organize the conference in a country like this in the first place? It's just better all round if organizers choose countries with better (easier) Visa systems than US/EU/UK/...

I know at least one that moved out the US for this reason.

Re: Conferences are inadvertently excluding many attendees from foreign countries

#59

Post by veltas »

light_hue_1 wrote: post #49
ggm wrote: post #17

If you're an American university with a teaching or research Reactor, make sure your conference organisers know attendees from China, Iran, Cuba, Venezuela, Syria may be required not to be within a statutory minimum distance. It's hugely confronting and embarrassing for invited speakers, paper authors to arrive and then get excluded and escorted off campus.

I worked in a building with a research reactor for years. In my office I had other students from China. A student from Iran worked on the reactor. We all went in tours together. This is not a federal rule. No one was required to be any distance away from the reactor based on their nationality. No one checked passports at the entrance to our building. The doors were just open. That's why you can't find this rule onlin…

Power trip sounds more likely to me.

Re: Conferences are inadvertently excluding many attendees from foreign countries

#60

Post by puttycat »

Plus, getting hundreds of people to take flights from all over the world in order to watch keynotes seems very disconnected from current state of the world.

Yes, there are advantages to in-person meetings, keynotes, etc. But specifically for conferences they are undermined by the ecological price.

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