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English is a pictographic language with 26 radicals

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Re: English is a pictographic language with 26 radicals

#11

Then you get Hiberno-English where "ough" _can_ sound like "ock" (Ballybough road in Dublin) and "Niamh" is "Neeve" and Siobhan is "Shu-vawn"

In fairness though, Niamh and Siobhán are names from another language!

You do get dialectical differences in Irish and there's some spelling reform stuff, but at least for the most part there's some internal consistency (to the dialect) in how stuff should be pronounced.

Re: English is a pictographic language with 26 radicals

#12
(non-native here) I've been saying this for as long as I remember. Non-Anglophones often get frustrated in attempt to (de)construct a word in English like they would in other European languages only to find that it doesn't work and they don't understand why. I often say you'll have a much easier time accepting English if you consider it to be more like Mandarin; a collection of images. The only difference is that unlike an image of a drawing (of a house or a tree), a word in English is an image of letters. But it's still an image! It's not a word with individual letters, you can't break it apart; you have to memorise it instead. So don't feel bad for not knowing how something is pronounced, because native Anglophones will not know either.

Re: English is a pictographic language with 26 radicals

#13

Then you get Hiberno-English where "ough" _can_ sound like "ock" (Ballybough road in Dublin) and "Niamh" is "Neeve" and Siobhan is "Shu-vawn"

That is less Hiberno-English and more Gaelic. Niamh and Siobhán are Irish names following Irish orthography.

Re: English is a pictographic language with 26 radicals

#15

My teacher used to argue that modern English would have been better off taking the Chinese writing system rather than the Roman one. The way it works now you have all the drawbacks (i.e. you need to memorise a whole lot of pronunciation) but none of the benefit (i.e. faster reading speeds, more compact representation).

No, modern English would have been better off taking, uh, almost any other European language's spelling system.

Re: English is a pictographic language with 26 radicals

#16

My teacher used to argue that modern English would have been better off taking the Chinese writing system rather than the Roman one. The way it works now you have all the drawbacks (i.e. you need to memorise a whole lot of pronunciation) but none of the benefit (i.e. faster reading speeds, more compact representation).

part of this comes from a fun little stupid historic coincidence

1. the writing of English was (let's call it) standardized

2. not long after (in historic terms) society decided to majorly shift/change pronunciation of a good part but not all of the language

=> so now part of the language fit's it's spelling, and part is shifted away from it in various degrees

By re-fitting the spelling to match the pronunciation it could be mostly fixed. That just is sadly not really doable.

Re: English is a pictographic language with 26 radicals

#17

Sometimes even the entire word is pronounced differently: read/read

IMO this long/short vowel ambiguity is the #1 broken feature of English spelling, and could be reliably fixed by adopting an acute accent to mark long vowels (where a double letter isn't already doing the job).

As in:

I love to réad. Shé read all my books. I watched the gáme líve. Shé lives at hóme. Eurydicé had a fíníte supply of pátience.

Etc.

It wouldn't change any of the ASCII-only spelling rules, and would be a tremendous help to English learners. Since most text is written on smartphones nowadays, the new accented spellings would be immediately widely adopted as soon as the three OS vendors in the English world (Microsoft, Apple, Google) turned them on in their autocorrects.

Of course there's no instance or process that could push through a change like this because English, unlike French and German for example, is not a language whose evolution is actively managed by a national committee.

Re: English is a pictographic language with 26 radicals

#18

(non-native here) I've been saying this for as long as I remember. Non-Anglophones often get frustrated in attempt to (de)construct a word in English like they would in other European languages only to find that it doesn't work and they don't understand why. I often say you'll have a much easier time accepting English if you consider it to be more like Mandarin; a collection of images. The only difference is that unl…

That's the current situation because spelling reflects pronunciation as it was hundreds of years ago. Basically spoken language moved on, but orthography remained fixed. In languages that standardized their spelling later, or implemented large scale spelling reforms, the discrepancy is smaller. But English is so spread out now with no central authority, so for sake of compatibility, it won't really be reformed now.

Re: English is a pictographic language with 26 radicals

#19
post #8

My teacher used to argue that modern English would have been better off taking the Chinese writing system rather than the Roman one. The way it works now you have all the drawbacks (i.e. you need to memorise a whole lot of pronunciation) but none of the benefit (i.e. faster reading speeds, more compact representation).

Rather than going to that extreme, English spelling could be made easier. My native language is Dutch. For Dutch there are spelling reforms every so many years. English is still using Shakespeare's spelling, I think. The advantage of spelling reforms is that spelling can stay much closer to how a word is pronounced, and that it's much more standardized. The disadvantage is that older texts become hard to read much so…

English is spread out all over the globe with no mechanism to coordinate such a reform.

Re: English is a pictographic language with 26 radicals

#20

My teacher used to argue that modern English would have been better off taking the Chinese writing system rather than the Roman one. The way it works now you have all the drawbacks (i.e. you need to memorise a whole lot of pronunciation) but none of the benefit (i.e. faster reading speeds, more compact representation).

The simplest way to use the alphabet is to do it like Spanish does: It is purely phonetic so you write the way you pronunce and you read the way it is written. Simple. That's how they end up with "fútbol" for "football": That's how it's pronunced in Spanish so that's how they spell it, and anyone can immediately read it as well.

Meanwhile in French... 'taon', 'tant', 'temps', 'tends' all pronunced exactly the same because French loves silent letters.

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