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The rise of the open kitchen

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Re: The rise of the open kitchen

#21

Post by sdm »

faitswulff wrote: post #2

I was hoping this was going to talk about the increasingly trendy open kitchen concept in homes, or more specifically answer the question: why have kitchens traditionally been separated from dining areas in the first place? Unfortunately, the article is about restaurants.

> why have kitchens traditionally been separated from dining areas in the first place?

Smell. To keep the smells of cooking from overwhelming the rest of the house. In the process of building a new house and it will be a separate kitchen. Well, technically, a wet kitchen that is closed off and a small dry kitchen connected to the dining area for dealing with things that aren't strong smelling. This setup is pretty standard in here in Asia.

Re: The rise of the open kitchen

#22

Post by bombcar »

randomdata wrote: post #10
ip26 wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

why have kitchens traditionally been separated from dining areas in the first place? Not long ago, cooking was often done exclusively by “the help”.

The cooking is still exclusively done by "the help" in restaurants, but the article indicates that the theatre, so to speak, of food preparation has come to be considered a desirable trait by those occupying the dining room. So this doesn't quite answer why they settled on keeping it hidden instead of a display of entertainment. There is no reason to think people in that time wouldn't have found the same enjoyment in…

Even now many restaurants don't "show the sausage being made" because they're not that type of presentation.

And even the ones that do have a theatre of sorts have background preparation and dish-washing that nobody wants to see.

Re: The rise of the open kitchen

#23

Post by Swizec »

m463 wrote: post #17
faitswulff wrote: post #2

I was hoping this was going to talk about the increasingly trendy open kitchen concept in homes, or more specifically answer the question: why have kitchens traditionally been separated from dining areas in the first place? Unfortunately, the article is about restaurants.

This is a wonderful trend. Cooking goes on, mixed with kids homework or peers socializing, and it pulls everyone together. Another nice trend is street level shops and restaurants mixed with housing above. This fights the "estate for everyone" mcmansion trend that separates people.

> Another nice trend is street level shops and restaurants mixed with housing above

FYI this is how most non-american towns and cities have been designed for … ever? Go into any European old town center and it’s full of street level shops with residential on the floors above. Judging from popular photos, much of Asia and Africa are like this as well.

Re: The rise of the open kitchen

#24

Post by bombcar »

faitswulff wrote: post #2

I was hoping this was going to talk about the increasingly trendy open kitchen concept in homes, or more specifically answer the question: why have kitchens traditionally been separated from dining areas in the first place? Unfortunately, the article is about restaurants.

Many good reasons below - but another one is that framing large rooms is (was) expensive until pretty close to modern times with laminated beams, etc. So you'd want to make as many smaller rooms as you could already just for cost reasons, and so making everything a separate room followed pretty closely.

Now, for the poorer people (majority?) they'd have similar sized rooms, just fewer - and the kitchen would often double as a dining room (and the living room might double as a formal dining room, if present).

I find I much prefer "openable concept" than open concept - large sliding doors to the kitchen, perhaps, or a drop down under a hutch onto a breakfast bar, so you can close the kitchen off from the rest of the house if you want.

Re: The rise of the open kitchen

#25

Post by bombcar »

ljlolel wrote: post #20

My theory is that open kitchens became popular because books like Anthony Bourdain’s Kitchen Confidential exposed the elites to the fact that cooks were messing with their food. So they devised this open concept as a Panopticon where cooks are constantly watched to prevent licking, peeing in, or putting other fluids in food.

Any good cook can slip anything into the food even if you're staring at him; but it might make the elites feel better.

I feel bad about this whole thing, because half the fun of working a restaurant is being able to talk and joke behind the scenes, which you can't do if you're perpetually "on display".

Re: The rise of the open kitchen

#26

Post by canvascritic »

The rise of open kitchens feels like just another facet of our panoptic tech age. Everything and every job and every person is under surveillance, every task monitored, every move assessed against metrics, every act rateable. there's hardly any realm of work now where you're not being constantly observed and judged, and having to perform for that rating, not even minimum wage work now. Maybe it's not just about transparency, maybe it never was about transparency, or it was about the one way kind of transparency. And also about control.

Re: The rise of the open kitchen

#27

Post by osigurdson »

faitswulff wrote: post #2

I was hoping this was going to talk about the increasingly trendy open kitchen concept in homes, or more specifically answer the question: why have kitchens traditionally been separated from dining areas in the first place? Unfortunately, the article is about restaurants.

It is probably hard to find a house with a separate kitchen these days. M

Re: The rise of the open kitchen

#28

Post by osigurdson »

Swizec wrote: post #23
m463 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a wonderful trend. Cooking goes on, mixed with kids homework or peers socializing, and it pulls everyone together. Another nice trend is street level shops and restaurants mixed with housing above. This fights the "estate for everyone" mcmansion trend that separates people.

> Another nice trend is street level shops and restaurants mixed with housing above FYI this is how most non-american towns and cities have been designed for … ever? Go into any European old town center and it’s full of street level shops with residential on the floors above. Judging from popular photos, much of Asia and Africa are like this as well.

I think detached houses with yards are better.

Re: The rise of the open kitchen

#29

Post by Swizec »

osigurdson wrote: post #28
Swizec wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Another nice trend is street level shops and restaurants mixed with housing above FYI this is how most non-american towns and cities have been designed for … ever? Go into any European old town center and it’s full of street level shops with residential on the floors above. Judging from popular photos, much of Asia and Africa are like this as well.

I think detached houses with yards are better.

Nah detached houses with yards are the worst of both worlds. You get neither the easily accessible town/city experience nor enough land to do anything interesting with.

But I’m probably biased because I grew up in a city and regularly visited grandparents with legit farms. If you’re gonna have land, it should support at least a decent-sized garden … maybe a few fruit trees, nice shed, couple chickens.

You definitely don’t want a yard that’s spitting distance to your neighbors’ house, that’s just silly.

Re: The rise of the open kitchen

#30

Post by prawn »

bombcar wrote: post #24
faitswulff wrote: post #2

I was hoping this was going to talk about the increasingly trendy open kitchen concept in homes, or more specifically answer the question: why have kitchens traditionally been separated from dining areas in the first place? Unfortunately, the article is about restaurants.

Many good reasons below - but another one is that framing large rooms is (was) expensive until pretty close to modern times with laminated beams, etc. So you'd want to make as many smaller rooms as you could already just for cost reasons, and so making everything a separate room followed pretty closely. Now, for the poorer people (majority?) they'd have similar sized rooms, just fewer - and the kitchen would often do…

Also easier to heat or cool smaller spaces. In the case of a kitchen, you can isolate and exhaust heat.
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