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70 years ago, an Anglo-US coup condemned Iran to decades of oppression

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11–20 of 210 posts

Re: 70 years ago, an Anglo-US coup condemned Iran to decades of oppression

#11
post #5

Sad to see what Iran has become - no in small part thanks to the US/UK's meddling and installing a crazed theocratic government. The Iranian people deserve so much better - they are a nation of really smart people and would be a beacon in the Middle East if it wasn't for a bunch of religious reactionaries holding power. Some of the best engineers I've ever worked with were expat Iranians who left and have no intentio…

US/UK didn't install the current ruling set of islamists.

Re: 70 years ago, an Anglo-US coup condemned Iran to decades of oppression

#12

All war boils down to the ability to access, control or set pricing for a natural resource The perennial Iran/Iraq conflicts originated from disputes about access to the Shatt al-Arab River starting in the 16th century - once the industrial revolution hit, then of course oil was the key resource for growth The Overthrow of the Shah then, was based on the requirement to not be beholden to anyone but the west when pric…

The US and UK didn't overthrow the Shah, they helped him stop from being overthrown. If you can't even get the basics of the historical events we're talking about correct, you shouldn't be making broad generalizations about all of history.

Re: 70 years ago, an Anglo-US coup condemned Iran to decades of oppression

#13
TBF the big shots have been putting their mouths into Iran much earlier than that. The British and USSR even had a plan to invade Iran because they were close to Germany back in the day. Of course German posing itself as the liberator because it wants the oil but Britain was blocking it from do so.

Re: 70 years ago, an Anglo-US coup condemned Iran to decades of oppression

#14
post #5

Sad to see what Iran has become - no in small part thanks to the US/UK's meddling and installing a crazed theocratic government. The Iranian people deserve so much better - they are a nation of really smart people and would be a beacon in the Middle East if it wasn't for a bunch of religious reactionaries holding power. Some of the best engineers I've ever worked with were expat Iranians who left and have no intentio…

[deleted]

Re: 70 years ago, an Anglo-US coup condemned Iran to decades of oppression

#15

There's a certain strain of political outlook exemplified by an article like this, commonly categorized as "post-colonial", that ironically morphs itself into increasingly complex and implausible shapes to explain why all of the bad things are caused by the "first world" and nobody else has or will ever have any autonomy as an agent in the world. The other aspect of irony to this is that this worldview is cultivated…

You didn't know? Everything bad is the West's fault.

Meanwhile Iran's secular base disintegrates rapidly while the fundamentalist Islamists increase their stranglehold on their people.

Re: 70 years ago, an Anglo-US coup condemned Iran to decades of oppression

#16

All war boils down to the ability to access, control or set pricing for a natural resource The perennial Iran/Iraq conflicts originated from disputes about access to the Shatt al-Arab River starting in the 16th century - once the industrial revolution hit, then of course oil was the key resource for growth The Overthrow of the Shah then, was based on the requirement to not be beholden to anyone but the west when pric…

All war is about resources except for all the times it isn’t: religion, culture, honor/shame or ideology.

Two world wars come to mind

Re: 70 years ago, an Anglo-US coup condemned Iran to decades of oppression

#17
post #12

All war boils down to the ability to access, control or set pricing for a natural resource The perennial Iran/Iraq conflicts originated from disputes about access to the Shatt al-Arab River starting in the 16th century - once the industrial revolution hit, then of course oil was the key resource for growth The Overthrow of the Shah then, was based on the requirement to not be beholden to anyone but the west when pric…

The US and UK didn't overthrow the Shah, they helped him stop from being overthrown. If you can't even get the basics of the historical events we're talking about correct, you shouldn't be making broad generalizations about all of history.

I said nothing about the US or UK overthrowing the Shah

Re: 70 years ago, an Anglo-US coup condemned Iran to decades of oppression

#18

TBF the big shots have been putting their mouths into Iran much earlier than that. The British and USSR even had a plan to invade Iran because they were close to Germany back in the day. Of course German posing itself as the liberator because it wants the oil but Britain was blocking it from do so.

The British and Soviet Union did invade and occupy Iran during the war. It was focused on controlling the railroads, but it led to the then Shah to abdicate.

Re: 70 years ago, an Anglo-US coup condemned Iran to decades of oppression

#19

There's a certain strain of political outlook exemplified by an article like this, commonly categorized as "post-colonial", that ironically morphs itself into increasingly complex and implausible shapes to explain why all of the bad things are caused by the "first world" and nobody else has or will ever have any autonomy as an agent in the world. The other aspect of irony to this is that this worldview is cultivated…

You didn't know? Everything bad is the West's fault. Meanwhile Iran's secular base disintegrates rapidly while the fundamentalist Islamists increase their stranglehold on their people.

The people clearly support the Iranian government.

Whether or not you or I have anything to say about that is pretty irrelevant as I am not an Iranian citizen, and you are unlikely to be one.

von Mises once said that every government is fundamentally democratic because even the most autarchic government requires the governing consent of its people. This is clearly true.

This whole "people in the West get to decide whether or not a government is valid, but also they are evil bad guys" thing is really getting old.

Re: 70 years ago, an Anglo-US coup condemned Iran to decades of oppression

#20
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US and UK didn't overthrow the Shah, they helped him stop from being overthrown. If you can't even get the basics of the historical events we're talking about correct, you shouldn't be making broad generalizations about all of history.

I said nothing about the US or UK overthrowing the Shah

Then this sentence makes absolutely no sense: "The Overthrow of the Shah then, was based on the requirement to not be beholden to anyone but the west when pricing Oil, to ensure the west had unmitigated control of how the largest oil property set prices."
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