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Radiation Spikes at Chernobyl

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Re: Radiation Spikes at Chernobyl

#81

Post by [deleted] »

mepian wrote: post #30
renegade-otter wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You underestimate Russia's induced ignorance about Chernobyl. Most of these 20-year-olds were from remote, shit-poor areas of Russia, and even if they went to school of some sort, it didn't matter much. You think those textbooks mentioned the incident? No. To this day, Chernobyl is a pain point for Russia - f--k knows why because it didn't even happen there . When HBO's Chernobyl came out, Moscow went into a full-blo…

That hysteria wasn't caused by the ignorance of Russia's population. Everyone knew about the disaster for a long time. I know this because I lived there until recently.

[deleted]

Re: Radiation Spikes at Chernobyl

#82

Post by mepian »

ChatGTP wrote: post #51
renegade-otter wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You underestimate Russia's induced ignorance about Chernobyl. Most of these 20-year-olds were from remote, shit-poor areas of Russia, and even if they went to school of some sort, it didn't matter much. You think those textbooks mentioned the incident? No. To this day, Chernobyl is a pain point for Russia - f--k knows why because it didn't even happen there . When HBO's Chernobyl came out, Moscow went into a full-blo…

Do you know the name of the show, I’d like to watch it

It's also called Chernobyl: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt14780354/

Re: Radiation Spikes at Chernobyl

#83

Post by arcticbull »

cf141q5325 wrote: post #21
dylan604 wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Being from the West, it is very difficult to think that information black out can be achieved at such a level that younger generations would know nothing of a disaster on the level of Chernobyl.

You dont really need a blackout. How many people can actually tell you the size and location of the contamination? Even the official limits of the exclusion zone are nonsense dating back to Soviet Bureaucracy. Wind meant there are contaminated areas outside and harmless areas inside. Also like the article stated, they are unlikely to have experienced any negative impact themselves. Also, the Greenpeace statement ment…

How about Semipalatinsk in Kazakhstan? Atomic Lake? Hundreds of nuclear weapons tested all over the steppe - and open to the public. If you were an American soldier deployed there would you have a single clue you shouldn’t be digging near Opytnoe Pole? Or avoid catching fish from Lake Chagan?

Or a Russian soldier deployed at the Nevada test site?

I think not knowing is quite plausible.

Re: Radiation Spikes at Chernobyl

#84

Post by Moldoteck »

dylan604 wrote: post #5
jncfhnb wrote: post #2

> The IAEA sent experts to do a radiological survey in the CEZ in April, but their focus wasn’t on determining the cause of the spikes. Investigators instead wanted to determine if Russian soldiers who dug trenches in a small section of the CEZ had released dangerous levels of radiation in that area that could have sickened the soldiers or anyone else who passed through that area. (The IAEA determined the radiation l…

Being from the West, it is very difficult to think that information black out can be achieved at such a level that younger generations would know nothing of a disaster on the level of Chernobyl.

You are too optimistic about Russian education system in poor regions.

Even ignoring tons of corruption and the fact that many teenagers are skipping school to do house/agriculture/other work, consider the fact that those schools are severely underfunded and good teachers migrated long time ago for a better life to bigger cities and even if they have internet, that doesn't meen the information they consume is educational type. I've seen some similar regions when I've visited Russia when I was in school and it looked depressing and I've only visited a bit of west part. The eastern russia is has much bigger problems in this regard, aside mybe from big cities.

And that's just abt education, other comments abt how soldiers maybe didn't know where they are or were thinking that all Chernobyl is a thing of past may be also true

Re: Radiation Spikes at Chernobyl

#85

Post by tguvot »

mepian wrote: post #75
tguvot wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

as somebody who born in russia you can't represent everybodies in russia knowledge. in case you don't watch them, go watch some of zolkin videos where he asks russian solders questions about history and ukraine. very enlightening

Sure, you can always cherry-pick someone from a remote village so this can't be literally "everybody", but it's absurd to claim that the majority of the population doesn't know about Chernobyl. It was a very hot topic in Russia for a long time, and in the 90s the government lost control over the information space of the country so the information about Chernobyl was spreading freely. The younger generations can learn…

Sure, you can always cherry-pick someone from major city so this can't be literally "everybody", but it's absurd to claim that the majority of the population knows about Chernobyl.

For christ sakes, as you state, there is a whole new generation that was born after 2000 in russia. 90s are out and there is control of information> it doesn't matter that they can learn about this topic from internet or hbo or stalker (yes, sure, all gamers will assume that game is based on real events). if they are not taught about it, they won't know.

did you see new history books in russia btw that were published a couple of weeks ago ? do you see the new versions of history been on tv ? the laws about spreading "false information about ussr in wwII" ?

Re: Radiation Spikes at Chernobyl

#86

Post by mepian »

tguvot wrote: post #85
mepian wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, you can always cherry-pick someone from a remote village so this can't be literally "everybody", but it's absurd to claim that the majority of the population doesn't know about Chernobyl. It was a very hot topic in Russia for a long time, and in the 90s the government lost control over the information space of the country so the information about Chernobyl was spreading freely. The younger generations can learn…

Sure, you can always cherry-pick someone from major city so this can't be literally "everybody", but it's absurd to claim that the majority of the population knows about Chernobyl. For christ sakes, as you state, there is a whole new generation that was born after 2000 in russia. 90s are out and there is control of information> it doesn't matter that they can learn about this topic from internet or hbo or stalker (ye…

Listen, I left Russia last year. I lived there my whole life, and I saw how the government was handling this topic with my own eyes. Putin likes to twist history to his whims, but the topic of Chernobyl specifically wasn't as affected by this as you seem to think. The worst thing I've seen is one conspiracy-loving TV channel pushing theories about the disaster getting caused by aliens or the Americans, but no one tried to pretend that the whole thing never happened. I know about all of these things too well, don't try to school me on this topic.

Re: Radiation Spikes at Chernobyl

#87

Post by cf141q5325 »

dralley wrote: post #63
cf141q5325 wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He is right, that part of the exclusion zone is relatively harmless. Greenpeace has the coordinates in their report, if i am not too far off people still eat mushrooms from such conditions. The story here seems to be tanks driving off the roads, not the digging at the camp site.

I recall seeing a heatmap of residual radiation levels produced in (I think?) 2015 and the reported location of the trenches was very close to the hottest part of it.

I posted the sources in the edits of https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37182828#37183914

Do you have another position for the trenches?

Re: Radiation Spikes at Chernobyl

#88

Post by tguvot »

mepian wrote: post #86
tguvot wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, you can always cherry-pick someone from major city so this can't be literally "everybody", but it's absurd to claim that the majority of the population knows about Chernobyl. For christ sakes, as you state, there is a whole new generation that was born after 2000 in russia. 90s are out and there is control of information> it doesn't matter that they can learn about this topic from internet or hbo or stalker (ye…

Listen, I left Russia last year. I lived there my whole life, and I saw how the government was handling this topic with my own eyes. Putin likes to twist history to his whims, but the topic of Chernobyl specifically wasn't as affected by this as you seem to think. The worst thing I've seen is one conspiracy-loving TV channel pushing theories about the disaster getting caused by aliens or the Americans, but no one tri…

i never said that topic of Chernobyl was affected in media. and i never said that majority do not know about it. i said that a bunch of russian solders occupying Chernobyl had no idea where they are and that based on Zolkin interviews history is taught in russia not in optimal way (probably at least outside of major population centers, which are not exactly russia anyhow)

Re: Radiation Spikes at Chernobyl

#89

Post by raverbashing »

nullc wrote: post #19
refulgentis wrote: post #3

Interesting until the extended meditations on "why didn't anyone look into this more?????" -- as laid out, IAEA knew and said so publicly, the readings were few and transitory (30m-2h), and if there was a hack, there's 0 real evidence and it's not clear to me it'd be worth disclosing publicly (Russia hacked nuclear radiation in a headline for a schoolboys prank level 'hack' that is completely unprovable)

A bunch of sensors don't just give very high readings at once by chance. There is a reason. If it had just been one sensor that would be another matter (and perhaps it needs to be replaced...) It doesn't make sense as a prank in that it was only a few sensors and not persistent, it's not like they drew a dick with the results or set them to over 9000.

A question I'm not seeing is: what types of sensors are they and what can trigger them?

Can they detect X-rays? EM Interference? Can dust or high humidity cause false readings?

Maybe it's the kickoff of dust but not necessarily because the dust is radioactive

Re: Radiation Spikes at Chernobyl

#90

Post by cf141q5325 »

petre wrote: post #77
cedws wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The story of Russians digging holes and getting radiation poisoning was propaganda, just like Ghost of Kiev. The levels of radiation in the soil are not high enough to cause radiation poisoning, except for very few hotspots that they'd have to go looking for. It's mostly alpha radiation left which is dangerous only if radioactive particles are inhaled. I'm more inclined to believe the IAEA. Also, >They concluded that…

Also Greenpeace investigated, so they are not a credible source after all the lobying and protests they did in Germany and which closed down nuclear power stations. The Ukrainians invited Grrenpeace likely to amplify the concerns. It was likely another propaganda attempt, as opposed to actual research.

The pictures from their report are a bit problematic. They sprinkled in pictures of the power plant among the pictures of the trenches. https://media.greenpeace.org/shoot/27MDHUHQAT5X
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