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China’s property giant Evergrande files for bankruptcy protection in Manhattan

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Re: China’s property giant Evergrande files for bankruptcy protection in Manhattan

#61
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>"real estate assets everywhere but China now look better in the long term." They do not look better. They look inflated and unaffordable. If not fixed this will have social consequences at some point and it won't be pretty.

Housing can't be inflated and unaffordable at the same time. Someone is buying properties, driving prices higher. Those someone can definitely afford housing.

They also can handle $100,000,000 boats. I am so happy for those poor souls

Re: China’s property giant Evergrande files for bankruptcy protection in Manhattan

#62

- Li Ka Shing, richest man in Hong Kong, just offered an immediate 30% off on his newest buildings for sale -> This also result in immediate sold-out with 22X over-subscription.

Smart guy ;) It's not his loan that's going to end up in arrears

Re: China’s property giant Evergrande files for bankruptcy protection in Manhattan

#63
post #33

Some real estate related news from China: - Country garden, China's second biggest property company after Evergrande, missed a mere 22.5M payments for dollar denominated bonds. It is trying to restructure a $340B debt owned. https://abcnews.go.com/Business/wireStory/chinas-government-... - Li Ka Shing, richest man in Hong Kong, just offered an immediate 30% off on his newest buildings for sale - One of China's bigges…

Government control over reproduction leads to unintended consequences? Who would've seen that coming?

Fertility rate across the world is dropping even without government intervention. Who knew having a higher standard of living means you don't need as many kids to work the farm, and indeed, that people simply don't want to give up that lifestyle in order to have kids?

Re: China’s property giant Evergrande files for bankruptcy protection in Manhattan

#64
post #2

Nice, creates corporation in tax havens to maximize tax dodging, files for bankruptcy in country that can actually put disgruntled debt owners to task. Good ol' capitalism.

Under "Good ol' capitalism" companies like Evergrande won't exist in the first place. Edit: CCP imposing market restrictions causing average folks to invest only in real estate is not "Good ol' capitalism".

'free market' implies liberalism (Smith, Hume).

Capitalism only imply that the capital owners decide what is produced, where, how, and how workers are treated/paid. It's in the name. In china's case, it isn't pure capitalism, it's a soviet-style capitalism (or a capitalist sovietism?) so I agree it isn't faire to reduce it to capitalism.

Re: China’s property giant Evergrande files for bankruptcy protection in Manhattan

#65
post #33

Some real estate related news from China: - Country garden, China's second biggest property company after Evergrande, missed a mere 22.5M payments for dollar denominated bonds. It is trying to restructure a $340B debt owned. https://abcnews.go.com/Business/wireStory/chinas-government-... - Li Ka Shing, richest man in Hong Kong, just offered an immediate 30% off on his newest buildings for sale - One of China's bigges…

Government control over reproduction leads to unintended consequences? Who would've seen that coming?

It's not automatically a bad thing.

China has done fantastically well economically, and in terms of health care, education etc. There are other countries which have had strict population control and have done well economically - such as Singapore, South Korea. I see nothing wrong with poorer countries keeping restrictions on population growth - so that they can increase the standard of living and make sure everyone gets education and healthcare.

Re: China’s property giant Evergrande files for bankruptcy protection in Manhattan

#66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, it is not looking good for their outlook. That said, nobody is seriously claiming Chinese youth unemployment at 50% unless you are looking at something like labor force participation rate, which is then a similar number for the US as well.

No, it can actually be 50%. Why do you think that's not serious? Greek youth unemployment was at 60% during their peak debt crisis. China's mega debt tsunami is starting to slam the shores right now. China already tried its hardest to suppress youth unemployment rates. Student councillors in China are given strict KPIs to ensure their students graduate with a job. So obviously they co-operate with shady companies tha…

Don't know about China and your country, but in my country they resolved unemployment rates by limiting the number of tickets that the ticketing machines print in every unemployment office. Now unemployment numbers are record low.

Re: China’s property giant Evergrande files for bankruptcy protection in Manhattan

#67
post #33

Some real estate related news from China: - Country garden, China's second biggest property company after Evergrande, missed a mere 22.5M payments for dollar denominated bonds. It is trying to restructure a $340B debt owned. https://abcnews.go.com/Business/wireStory/chinas-government-... - Li Ka Shing, richest man in Hong Kong, just offered an immediate 30% off on his newest buildings for sale - One of China's bigges…

Government control over reproduction leads to unintended consequences? Who would've seen that coming?

Except it’s been loosened after decades, and suddenly the economy tanks?

The more likely explanation is Xi’s authoritarianism and crackdown on the private sector. Anyone with a brain in China is trying to get their money and themselves out of the country.

Re: China’s property giant Evergrande files for bankruptcy protection in Manhattan

#68
post #5

There are many real estate giants and so-called "trust" companies who are incapable of repaying debt right now. Some of these companies have trillions in RMB on their balance sheets. The central bank can bail them out but at the expense of the assets of the middle and lower class. This would only further incentivize cash hoarding, and tighten the middle income trap. It is not an enviable situation.

Are they actually underwater or do they just have higher loan payments than rental income? If it's the latter, let them sell some properties or transfer them to the bank in lieu of loan payments.

Underwater. Totally underwater.

Re: China’s property giant Evergrande files for bankruptcy protection in Manhattan

#69

Some real estate related news from China: - Country garden, China's second biggest property company after Evergrande, missed a mere 22.5M payments for dollar denominated bonds. It is trying to restructure a $340B debt owned. https://abcnews.go.com/Business/wireStory/chinas-government-... - Li Ka Shing, richest man in Hong Kong, just offered an immediate 30% off on his newest buildings for sale - One of China's bigges…

Ka Shing, richest man in Hong Kong Talk about nominative determinism...

I wonder how nominative determinism works across languages. Given enough languages and names, one is bound to come up with any number of people whose life is nominatively determined.

Re: China’s property giant Evergrande files for bankruptcy protection in Manhattan

#70
post #5

There are many real estate giants and so-called "trust" companies who are incapable of repaying debt right now. Some of these companies have trillions in RMB on their balance sheets. The central bank can bail them out but at the expense of the assets of the middle and lower class. This would only further incentivize cash hoarding, and tighten the middle income trap. It is not an enviable situation.

Are they actually underwater or do they just have higher loan payments than rental income? If it's the latter, let them sell some properties or transfer them to the bank in lieu of loan payments.

The problem they have is that nobody buys their properties...
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