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19 year old from Florida commits suicide on Justin.tv

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Re: 19 year old from Florida commits suicide on Justin.tv

#111

Post by sh1mmer »

jasonbentley wrote: post #2

A kid broadcasts his death on your service, allegedly egged on by your community, and your CEO statement falls back on cut-and-paste boilerplate? Do better. Fast.

It would seem to me that they should have planned on this kind of scenario. It doesn't have to be specific they just have to be able to plug some words into a statement about something tragic, but uncomfirmed on their network.

It's basic risk management.

That said, people are always going to pick holes in whatever words you use. They are either not enough or too insincere.

Re: 19 year old from Florida commits suicide on Justin.tv

#112

Post by gills »

jasonbentley wrote: post #31
patio11 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> your CEO statement falls back on cut-and-paste boilerplate? >> You HAVE to fall on boilerplate or you will be crucified, by your lawyer if no one else. You just have to pick the right boilerplate: If what you say has happened, that is a terrible tragedy. We will be conducting an internal investigation of the matter. Justin.tv in no way condones comments of the nature you have described. If we find that someone has…

It's entirely possible, and should be second nature for any CEO, to draft a statement that's both legally prudent AND shows a modicum of empathy. What they shouldn't do is try to throw their own role into question until the facts are on the table. Try this: "Everyone at Justin.tv is deeply shocked and saddened by this news. In the upcoming days, we will conduct a thorough investigation of the events surrounding this…

I respect what you're trying to say here, but seriously: stop.

It's easy to be a critical asshat on the internet. How much different is your criticism from that of the forum members involved in this incident?

You can tell these guys all about how to respond when it's your business on the stump. Maybe they can't show empathy because it weakens their legal position. I just don't know.

It's natural to mourn, to be empathetic, and for some people it's natural to be assholes. Let's try to keep cool heads in this community and show support for both the family of Abraham K. Biggs, and for the startup involved. They will learn something from this. I hope we all do.

Re: 19 year old from Florida commits suicide on Justin.tv

#113

Post by mattmaroon »

dangrover wrote: post #94
fallentimes wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just curious - did you contemplate not even responding to the media? Or were you pretty much forced to? What sort of long-term impact did it have on your site?

The problem was that the Will Freund incident, and the exposure it received, threatened to cast all people with Aspergers as deranged homicidal maniacs. A few media outlets were sensitive towards the issues involved and wrote thoughtfully. Others, however, were sensationalist and did the opposite of what we hoped (e.g. Geraldo's show on FOX).

You know that actually is pretty sad. I've heard a lot of rumors about Aspergers and violence being linked, but a cursory internet search seems to show that there's little or no evidence.

As if sufferers didn't have enough problems to deal with.

Re: 19 year old from Florida commits suicide on Justin.tv

#114

Post by catch404 »

noonespecial wrote: post #63
tdavis wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seriously people? I didn't expect this to be taken well by most here (in fact it was an experiment to see if there was a limit to down-voting), but some of you seem to be on a war path now. It doesn't really matter what the Justin.tv CEO said. He pasted some boiler plate because there's nothing more to be said; the deed had been done. What do you want? An apology for not finding the video? For not policing the Intern…

Seriously people? I didn't expect this to be taken well by most here (in fact it was an experiment to see if there was a limit to down-voting), but some of you seem to be on a war path now. Oh, so now I'm a guinea pig in a sociology experiment when I come to hacker news? Nice. That makes it so much better. Don't think I'll be using ticket-bumbler either. Edit: Note for future. Ask HN: Paul, Is there a downvote limit…

Or, surely he could check out the arc source? Doesn't add much to his argument.

Re: 19 year old from Florida commits suicide on Justin.tv

#115

Post by SamReidHughes »

run4yourlives wrote: post #97
tdavis wrote: post #3

Pills? If you're going to live broadcast your own death, make it more interesting than watching paint dry. Sheesh.

Honestly, I think your account should be revoked after that comment, unless you see it fit to properly apologize. Also, when you have your (and your partner's) business linked in your profile, you should think twice about what you say. Your concern about your reputation may be little, but I'm sure your livelihood is a little more important. I'm left questioning not only your maturity, but that of user fallentimes, al…

You should think about your own maturity level before engaging in self-indulgent posts such as the one you just wrote.

The funny thing about the sentence I just wrote is that you could validly echo it back to me. At least the self-indulgence part. Unfortunately for you, I have been thinking about my maturity level while writing this post.

In all seriousness (and my first sentence was serious too), what we have here is that your comment's parent was written by a person who is comfortable with making light of human tragedy, something which you are uncomfortable with. I'm not sure what that has to do with maturity, and in fact I'm not sure what maturity is or why you think that attribute would be a sign of immaturity.

Re: 19 year old from Florida commits suicide on Justin.tv

#116

Post by [deleted] »

gills wrote: post #112
jasonbentley wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's entirely possible, and should be second nature for any CEO, to draft a statement that's both legally prudent AND shows a modicum of empathy. What they shouldn't do is try to throw their own role into question until the facts are on the table. Try this: "Everyone at Justin.tv is deeply shocked and saddened by this news. In the upcoming days, we will conduct a thorough investigation of the events surrounding this…

I respect what you're trying to say here, but seriously: stop. It's easy to be a critical asshat on the internet. How much different is your criticism from that of the forum members involved in this incident? You can tell these guys all about how to respond when it's your business on the stump. Maybe they can't show empathy because it weakens their legal position. I just don't know. It's natural to mourn, to be empat…

[deleted]

Re: 19 year old from Florida commits suicide on Justin.tv

#117

Post by run4yourlives »

SamReidHughes wrote: post #115
run4yourlives wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly, I think your account should be revoked after that comment, unless you see it fit to properly apologize. Also, when you have your (and your partner's) business linked in your profile, you should think twice about what you say. Your concern about your reputation may be little, but I'm sure your livelihood is a little more important. I'm left questioning not only your maturity, but that of user fallentimes, al…

You should think about your own maturity level before engaging in self-indulgent posts such as the one you just wrote. The funny thing about the sentence I just wrote is that you could validly echo it back to me. At least the self-indulgence part. Unfortunately for you, I have been thinking about my maturity level while writing this post. In all seriousness (and my first sentence was serious too), what we have here i…

I'm not sure how my post is self-indulgent, to be honest.

Most people would consider black humour regarding a suicide that basically just happened as inappropriate and immature. After a certain period has elapsed, some venues will allow for such an expression. (The fact that the parent is a -50 in rating as I write this confirms this social norm.)

People who make inopportune remarks tend to be those that are either not able to properly grasp the magnitude of a situation and deal with it in a dignified and respectful way; or even worse, can't pick up on the general consensus of others as to the degree of magnitude.

How well a person can read social situations is by definition, maturity.

Re: 19 year old from Florida commits suicide on Justin.tv

#118

Post by SamReidHughes »

tdavis wrote: post #51
tdavis wrote: post #3

Pills? If you're going to live broadcast your own death, make it more interesting than watching paint dry. Sheesh.

Seriously people? I didn't expect this to be taken well by most here (in fact it was an experiment to see if there was a limit to down-voting), but some of you seem to be on a war path now. It doesn't really matter what the Justin.tv CEO said. He pasted some boiler plate because there's nothing more to be said; the deed had been done. What do you want? An apology for not finding the video? For not policing the Intern…

This reminds me of something that happened to me after 9/11. In my teenage immaturity, I made a comment insinuating that America got what was coming to it. I'm not sure why I did that (the mind is good at rationalizing behavior after the fact, so I can't trust my own memories on the matter), but I think it was a reaction to the complete unanimous sorrow going on in the forum. Everybody thought that the attacks were a horrible thing, that the deaths were such a tragedy. It might have been that I was struck by the complete irrationality of their reactions -- people don't feel so angered about annual traffic accident fatality numbers. After their angered reactions, I apologized and gave an excuse somewhat like the parent comment.

Having been in this situation, I'd say that tdavis probably posted that under the same state of mind as I did. And now that I look back, I can't help but conclude that taking that state of mind is the right thing to do. After events like these, certain ideas become treated like "correct viewpoints" that good-thinking people have to have. Such as that America is the good guys, or that this event here was so tragic and that you should be mournful. And now that somebody has come along with a different attitude on the matter, we get to witness a hailstorm of people who don't simply disagree on the matter, but who hate him because his reactions are different to theirs.

Re: 19 year old from Florida commits suicide on Justin.tv

#119

Post by statictype »

SamReidHughes wrote: post #118
tdavis wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seriously people? I didn't expect this to be taken well by most here (in fact it was an experiment to see if there was a limit to down-voting), but some of you seem to be on a war path now. It doesn't really matter what the Justin.tv CEO said. He pasted some boiler plate because there's nothing more to be said; the deed had been done. What do you want? An apology for not finding the video? For not policing the Intern…

This reminds me of something that happened to me after 9/11. In my teenage immaturity, I made a comment insinuating that America got what was coming to it. I'm not sure why I did that (the mind is good at rationalizing behavior after the fact, so I can't trust my own memories on the matter), but I think it was a reaction to the complete unanimous sorrow going on in the forum. Everybody thought that the attacks were a…

And is it similarly irrational to mourn your Father's death more than the death of some random guy in a hospital you never knew?

Re: 19 year old from Florida commits suicide on Justin.tv

#120

Post by SamReidHughes »

statictype wrote: post #119
SamReidHughes wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This reminds me of something that happened to me after 9/11. In my teenage immaturity, I made a comment insinuating that America got what was coming to it. I'm not sure why I did that (the mind is good at rationalizing behavior after the fact, so I can't trust my own memories on the matter), but I think it was a reaction to the complete unanimous sorrow going on in the forum. Everybody thought that the attacks were a…

And is it similarly irrational to mourn your Father's death more than the death of some random guy in a hospital you never knew?

My comment was not about the question of which views are correct or rational or make sense.
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