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Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

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Re: Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

#221

Post by lamontcg »

runlevel1 wrote: post #127
lamontcg wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any DNS resolver libraries have a 4.5 second timeout? Maybe their infrastructure is just rotting.

glibc defaults to 5 sec, but the server wouldn't need to resolve the redirect domain -- that'd be the client's job. Unless it's doing so for some proprietary reason, of course. Or did you mean failing to resolve some internal service's hostname?

> Or did you mean failing to resolve some internal service's hostname?

Yeah, something more like that where the internal service is somehow 'sharded' due to some overly complicated distributed database nonsense, and there's a DNS lookup that is failing. Of course that'd mean the DNS lookup wasn't cached, so you're taking that normal latency on every single hit, which would be terrible architecture. The curl-vs-wget performance isn't explained by that though (although that's a bit weird in and of itself, and might suggest that they had to allow that for some internal tool that they didn't want to punish).

> glibc defaults to 5 sec,

The timeout being close to 5 seconds is what made me wonder about it. Its just off though.

Re: Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

#222

Post by latchkey »

joenot443 wrote: post #207
dang wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, yes, many sites are banned on HN. Others are penalized (see e.g. https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que... ). None of this is secret, though we don't publish the lists themselves. Edit: about 67k sites are banned on HN. Here's a random selection of 10 of them: vodlockertv.com biggboss.org infoocode.com newyorkpersonalinjuryattorneyblog.com moringajuice.wordpress.com surrogacymumbai.com max…

That's a lot of domains! Did you source that from some other list, or is that a result of 67k individual entries? Either way, I appreciate it. Out of curiosity, what's the rationale for blocking archive.is? Legal reasons I assume?

> That's a lot of domains!

Not really. 67k/350m=0.02%

Re: Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

#223

Post by DamonHD »

johngladtj wrote: post #201
dang wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't want us to be user hostile. Can you link to some examples?

I would consider any moderation action that isn't visible to users to be user hostile. If you're going to censor someone, you owe it to them to be honest about what you're doing to them.

You possibly haven't experienced how devious and determined and dishonest and unpleasant some bad actors are, including SPAMmers.

(Even when doing the RightThing(TM) would probably be easier...)

And, BTW, I occasionally get blocked by the mechanisms here, even though not doing anything bad, but understand that there is a trade-off.

Re: Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

#224

Post by tasubotadas »

amadeuspagel wrote: post #218
dang wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, yes, many sites are banned on HN. Others are penalized (see e.g. https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que... ). None of this is secret, though we don't publish the lists themselves. Edit: about 67k sites are banned on HN. Here's a random selection of 10 of them: vodlockertv.com biggboss.org infoocode.com newyorkpersonalinjuryattorneyblog.com moringajuice.wordpress.com surrogacymumbai.com max…

Maybe "major media" should include tech media like The Register, Ars Technica, Tech Dirt, etc.. Unlike with media like the NYT, Bloomberg or Reuters, I've never seen a story for which these sites were the best source and much of what they publish is blogspam summarizing stories that have already been posted on HN, usually with a votebait title.

This is mad take. Also, putting junk that nyt writes together with Reuters is just wrong.

Re: Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

#225

Post by DamonHD »

rhaksw wrote: post #91
lcnPylGDnU4H9OF wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That also requires additional effort on the spammers’ part. Increasing cost of attacks is an effective defense strategy.

Increasing cost of attacks is effective against good faith people, not spammers. Even Cory Doctorow made this case in "Como is Infosec" [1]. The only problem with Cory's argument is, he points people to the SC Principles [2]. The SCP contain exceptions for not notifying about "spam, phishing or malware." But anything can be considered spam, and transparency-with-exceptions has always been platforms' position. They've…

In my experience, increasing cost or delay even a little bit cuts out a disproportionate amount of bad stuff.

I once had the domain 'moronsinahurry' registered, though not with this group in mind...

Re: Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

#226

Post by bravogamma »

dang wrote: post #20
mutant_glofish wrote: post #18

I think that HN itself also shadow flags submissions from a list of domains it doesn't like. Try submitting a URL from the following domains, and it will be automatically flagged (but you can't see it's flagged unless you log out): - archive.is - watcher.guru - stacker.news - zerohedge.com - freebeacon.com - thefederalist.com - breitbart.com

Well, yes, many sites are banned on HN. Others are penalized (see e.g. https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que... ). None of this is secret, though we don't publish the lists themselves. Edit: about 67k sites are banned on HN. Here's a random selection of 10 of them: vodlockertv.com biggboss.org infoocode.com newyorkpersonalinjuryattorneyblog.com moringajuice.wordpress.com surrogacymumbai.com max…

Do you have get-out-of-jail or N-strikes-and-you're-out policies? What if someone's legitimate website gets caught in this? I've also long wondered about user specific shadow bans. Can you please shed light on this?

Re: Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

#227

Post by rpruiz »

dang wrote: post #20
mutant_glofish wrote: post #18

I think that HN itself also shadow flags submissions from a list of domains it doesn't like. Try submitting a URL from the following domains, and it will be automatically flagged (but you can't see it's flagged unless you log out): - archive.is - watcher.guru - stacker.news - zerohedge.com - freebeacon.com - thefederalist.com - breitbart.com

Well, yes, many sites are banned on HN. Others are penalized (see e.g. https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que... ). None of this is secret, though we don't publish the lists themselves. Edit: about 67k sites are banned on HN. Here's a random selection of 10 of them: vodlockertv.com biggboss.org infoocode.com newyorkpersonalinjuryattorneyblog.com moringajuice.wordpress.com surrogacymumbai.com max…

So, is there an algorithm to be features in the front page? —other than upvotes. If a site can be banned, can another one be promoted?

Re: Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

#228

Post by mtmail »

joenot443 wrote: post #207
dang wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, yes, many sites are banned on HN. Others are penalized (see e.g. https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que... ). None of this is secret, though we don't publish the lists themselves. Edit: about 67k sites are banned on HN. Here's a random selection of 10 of them: vodlockertv.com biggboss.org infoocode.com newyorkpersonalinjuryattorneyblog.com moringajuice.wordpress.com surrogacymumbai.com max…

That's a lot of domains! Did you source that from some other list, or is that a result of 67k individual entries? Either way, I appreciate it. Out of curiosity, what's the rationale for blocking archive.is? Legal reasons I assume?

It's unavailable a lot ("Tell HN: Archive.* Is Unavailable" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35749833 "Ask HN: Archive.is Captcha Problems Lately?" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37077049) so discussions tend to end up being about archive.is instead of the content.

Re: Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

#229

Post by chromoblob »

latchkey wrote: post #222
joenot443 wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a lot of domains! Did you source that from some other list, or is that a result of 67k individual entries? Either way, I appreciate it. Out of curiosity, what's the rationale for blocking archive.is? Legal reasons I assume?

> That's a lot of domains! Not really. 67k/350m=0.02%

And 0.02% is really a lot.

Re: Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

#230

Post by Crosseye_Jack »

rpruiz wrote: post #227
dang wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, yes, many sites are banned on HN. Others are penalized (see e.g. https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que... ). None of this is secret, though we don't publish the lists themselves. Edit: about 67k sites are banned on HN. Here's a random selection of 10 of them: vodlockertv.com biggboss.org infoocode.com newyorkpersonalinjuryattorneyblog.com moringajuice.wordpress.com surrogacymumbai.com max…

So, is there an algorithm to be features in the front page? —other than upvotes. If a site can be banned, can another one be promoted?

I could be wrong, but I was always under the impression that companies that are in ycombinator get an inital boast in the jobs posts but also quickly fall off as such links don't allow comments.
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