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Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

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Re: Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

#211

Post by djvdq »

_a9 wrote: post #46
kens wrote: post #15

I can confirm. NYT shows a five-second redirect delay: "wget https://t.co/4fs609qwWt ". It redirects to gov.uk immediately: "wget https://t.co/iigzas6QBx "

Im not getting the same time delay with curl - `time wget https://t.co/4fs609qwWt ` -> `0m5.389s` - `time curl -L https://t.co/4fs609qwWt ` -> `0m1.158s`

And now add browser user-agent to the curl request and watch how slow it gets.

- `time curl -A "Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/81.0" -L https://t.co/4fs609qwW` -> 4.730 total

- `time curl -L https://t.co/4fs609qwWt` -> 1.313 total

Same request, the only difference is user-agent.

Re: Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

#212

Post by JeremyNT »

ajb wrote: post #193
1vuio0pswjnm7 wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's working for me.

Which instance? None of the ones I'm trying are working. Maybe it's regional

You can refer to the full list on the github page[0] (which I find to be pretty accurate). I personally use La Contre-Voie[1] for no particular reason.

nitter.net was historically a little less reliable for me due to rate limiting, which is why I initially switched. They worked around the rate limiting issue now, so that may no longer be the case.

[0] https://github.com/zedeus/nitter/wiki/Instances

[1] https://nitter.lacontrevoie.fr/

Re: Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

#213

Post by djvdq »

lamontcg wrote: post #121
minimaxir wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It'd be weird that it's limited to specific outbound domains in that case.

domains load balanced across different servers in some overly complicated distributed topology with only one of them busted? although seems unlikely it just happens to be the NYT.

I don't think it's a problem with rotting infrastructure. Using curl those requests are quick, unless you pass user-agent from browser. 4.7s with firefox user-agent and 1.3s without it. Using twitter link to the same NYT article.

Re: Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

#214

Post by rhaksw »

em-bee wrote: post #202
rhaksw wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Spammers game the system while good-faith users get edged out. Spammers are determined actors who perceive threats everywhere, whereas good-faith users never imagine that a platform would secretly remove their content. Today, you see low quality content on social media, not because the world is dumb, but because the people who get their message out know the secret tricks. Secret suppression is extremely common [1]. M…

so to spammers shadowbanning makes no difference, but good-faith users somehow get discouraged even if they don't know they are shadowbanned just because they get no reaction to their posts? how is an explicit ban any less discouraging? i can't see how shadowbanning makes things worse for good-faith users. and evidently it does work against spammers here on HN (though we don't know if it is the shadow or the banning…

> how is an explicit ban any less discouraging?

It's about whose messages are sidelined, not who gets discouraged.

With shadow removals, good-faith users' content is elbowed out without their knowledge. Since they don't know about it, they don't adjust behavior and do not bring their comments elsewhere.

Over 50% of Reddit users have removed content they don't know about. Just look at what people say when they find out [1].

> and evidently it does work against spammers here on HN

It doesn't. It benefits people who know how to work the system. The more secret it is, the more special knowledge you need.

[1] https://www.reveddit.com/#say

Re: Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

#215

Post by hnburnsy »

0cf8612b2e1e wrote: post #118
BLKNSLVR wrote: post #102

I'd like to invoke Hanlon's razor here to at least cut down on the potential for over-the-top reactions that can be somewhat embarassing in retrospect: "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."

Absolutely not applicable to corporations. Bad faith actions are rampant, and I am unwilling to give the benefit of the doubt to billion dollar companies.

How about incompetence instead of stupidity, would that apply to many billion dollar companies?

Re: Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

#216

Post by pb7 »

xNeil wrote: post #86
chasing wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

I came to HN because it seemed to be a place of free dialogue. > It's certainly under no obligation to promote right-wing propaganda and hate. It's certainly under no obligation to promote any propaganda or hate. That's what makes the site great. The HN crowd is not your average layman - it's largely well read and educated people. Why not let them decide what is propaganda and what's not (as opposed to some arbitrary…

> The HN crowd is not your average layman - it's largely well read and educated people.

It most certainly is the exact mixture of people as you’d find elsewhere. The only difference is they’ll (we’ll) foam at the mouth over something vaguely tangential to tech vs. some other topic.

Here's a recent example of the type of take you might find here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37113312

Re: Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

#217

Post by shagie »

mutant_glofish wrote: post #115
pgeorgi wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's what "random 10 out of 67k sites" gives you. Your set was cherry-picked, dang's wasn't. That said, dailykos.com seems to be banned. Happy now?

> Your set was cherry-picked Not exactly cherry-picked, these were from things I submitted myself and noticed that were shadow flagged. > That said, dailykos.com seems to be banned. Happy now? No, I'd be happy when archive.is, Federalist and the rest of the non-spammy ones are unbanned. (Also, even if "balanced" censorship was the desired goal, having a single unreliable left-wing source banned vs a ton of right-wing…

Turn on show dead, browse https://news.ycombinator.com/newest and take the affirmative community moderation steps of vouching for those that are good.

Archive.is shouldn't ever need to be the primary site. Post a link to the original and then a comment to the archive site if there's the possibility of take down or issues with paywalls.

It is likely that people were using archive.is for trying to avoid posting the original domain and masking the content that it presented.

Re: Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

#218

Post by amadeuspagel »

dang wrote: post #20
mutant_glofish wrote: post #18

I think that HN itself also shadow flags submissions from a list of domains it doesn't like. Try submitting a URL from the following domains, and it will be automatically flagged (but you can't see it's flagged unless you log out): - archive.is - watcher.guru - stacker.news - zerohedge.com - freebeacon.com - thefederalist.com - breitbart.com

Well, yes, many sites are banned on HN. Others are penalized (see e.g. https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que... ). None of this is secret, though we don't publish the lists themselves. Edit: about 67k sites are banned on HN. Here's a random selection of 10 of them: vodlockertv.com biggboss.org infoocode.com newyorkpersonalinjuryattorneyblog.com moringajuice.wordpress.com surrogacymumbai.com max…

Maybe "major media" should include tech media like The Register, Ars Technica, Tech Dirt, etc.. Unlike with media like the NYT, Bloomberg or Reuters, I've never seen a story for which these sites were the best source and much of what they publish is blogspam summarizing stories that have already been posted on HN, usually with a votebait title.

Re: Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

#219

Post by piaste »

spiderfarmer wrote: post #184
nvm0n2 wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably a phishing/malware scan gone wrong then. NYTimes has Twitterbot in its robots.txt which might be related? Even if it's deliberate, I don't see how people can complain. Google has outright blocked Breitbart for years. They prevent results from that domain from appearing at all unless you specifically force it with site: and apparently HN does the same. Politically motivated censorship and restricting "reach"…

Does the value Breitbart adds to the internet outweigh the negatives of turning people into dangerous fascists by weaponizing misinformation? No. Does the value added by sources like the NYT outweigh the negatives of being occasionally biased or outright wrong? Yes.

There is no objective, public, or shared "value" at play here.

The only "values" that matter are the personal whims of whoever happens to own Twitter, or Google or Facebook.

Re: Tell HN: t.co is adding a five-second delay to some domains

#220

Post by PenguinCoder »

kens wrote: post #15

I can confirm. NYT shows a five-second redirect delay: "wget https://t.co/4fs609qwWt ". It redirects to gov.uk immediately: "wget https://t.co/iigzas6QBx "

Now do additional testing by adding and setting the http referer to t.co or twitter. Is it Twitter, or is it NYtimes doing this?
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