Live data from Hacker News

The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

okdoomer.io

111–120 of 371 posts

Re: The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

#111
the worst part isnt even in the article. Now that companies in places like LA and NYC know productivity doesnt take a hit from remote work, and remote packages are a selling point for hiring managers, they can sunset their leases and walk away from slumlords pushing overpriced office space.

Fortune 10 and 50 companies will probably mandate everyone go back to work because theyre heavily invested in the type of real estate that could crucify them in a crash, but for the 99% of remaining employers the choice is an absolute no brainer. The small architecture firm, the payment processing company, local accountants and underwriters will all ignore the shot across the bow from elites and save a ton of cash in the process.

Its not about if but when at this point. Biden sent all the federal workers back to the office but it isnt going to be enough. Elites are going to take a bite of what could wind up being a nearly trillion dollar shit sandwich they cooked up in their own kitchen.

Re: The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

#112
post #105
post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This question should have made the author delete this essay, and is why it has no business being promoted on a supposedly legitimate aggregator like hacker news. The author is either a straight up liar working to subvert what little is left of American capitalism. Or they're a conspiracy theory whacko who doesn't know the slightest thing about "the elite," or any of the people/factions that comprise it.

Yeah maybe, but maybe its helpful to think what the holders of commercial real estate debt do to avoid the catastrophe? Surely, they are not just sitting and waiting. The offices are empty. The companies are doing just fine. There need to be external pressures applied to bring people back to the offices, I'd think.

Sure. They might be commissioning a harvard business professor to write about productivity gains of being in-office. They might lobby for some regulation to force a liability onto companies with remote workers. But what they aren't doing is getting 1000 of the richest people in the world into a room and coordinating a conspiracy to help some corner of the room not go bankrupt.

Re: The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

#113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unions.

>Unions. From my recent experience, unions can't help you keep remote work they way they work here today. I work(ed) at a unionized German company and when management call everyone back to the office after the Covid vaccination was done, it wasn't protested by the unions and everyone sowed up at the office without protest, and remote work was kept as "in case of emergency" perk you can get every now and then if you g…

In the orthodox Marxism still practiced by some Trotskyites, the factory worker is seen as a uniquely revolutionary class because of (1) the discipline that comes from factory work and (2) the factory as itself as a nexus of revolution: workers can organize there and ultimately seize control of the means of production.

A knowledge worker who works at home on cloud servers has no spatial nexus to control. All communication between workers is electronically mediated, I guess union organizers can develop a parallel infrastructure, but the workplace itself is a natural place for organizing work to take place.

What amuses me though is that until 1980 or so people thought factory work was the worst kind of work, maybe best expressed in the Ray Davies song "Working At the Factory"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J0khnH1qi6M

Once the factories left, however, people realized service work or no work was a lot worse and now a new factory in your town is one of the best things a politician can take credit for.

Re: The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

#114
post #24

How are "the elite" forcing companies that do not own real estate and who rent their office space to mandate RTO? How are they forcing these companies to renew their leases when they expire?

Shareholders, local/state governments that are basically in the grip of developers and real estate investors/landlords, Wall Street, cocktail parties, (bad) middle managers rioting, the feeling that if your underlings have all the freedoms you have they're less like underlings and more like peers, the usual class warfare stuff.

[dead]

Re: The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

#115
post #24

How are "the elite" forcing companies that do not own real estate and who rent their office space to mandate RTO? How are they forcing these companies to renew their leases when they expire?

Even companies that do own commercial real estate but aren't in that business must see it as a sunk cost and that employees are volunteering to provide their own office space for free .

This isn't true re: it being a sunk cost.

Real estate like that is actually (well, in the olden days) an appreciating long-term asset as well as a well-lobbied avenue for balance sheet games. Commercial real estate is subject to yearly depreciation, unlike your home. It can be somewhat arbitarily valued or devalued (see the games that Trump plays with real estate and taxes, sorry to introduce some politics), but generally real estate is tangible and appreciates long term.

Although if a company has a RECENTLY constructed office then it very much is a sunk cost, because the depreciation is on a 10 or 20 year schedule (don't remember exactly) and hasn't appreciated, and of course they haven't gotten the actual "house workers who make money for you" return. SO I agree with that. And of course all the companies don't want to see their already-depreciated by market appreciated values collapse under them. They want more sucker startups to but their appreciated properties once their business model ages.

Now, I guess we'll see how much the author's contention of a bubble/apocalypse plays out, but we'll know if office tower -> housing becomes a recurring thing. It wasn't with dilapidated malls, although it probably should have been.

As hinted at, the masters of office space are very well integrated with local politicians and the pork train. It's one of the pillars of local politics and local corruption. They'll try to find ways to get tax breaks or find a bigger sucker (like the local government!) to take on the burden or bail them out.

Re: The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

#116
post #24

How are "the elite" forcing companies that do not own real estate and who rent their office space to mandate RTO? How are they forcing these companies to renew their leases when they expire?

Thats just it, outside of the media outlets they control and federal policy, they cannot. Its largely a propaganda campaign and a thinly veiled one at that.

Biden was told by elites this was about to become a trillion dollar shit sandwich for the economy during a rocky period of high inflation and stagnation. He symbolically called all the federal workers back into offices (already owned by the government) as a show of "the right thing to do" but otherwise any company outside the fortune 50 will absolutely use this as an opportunity to tell their landlord to pound sand.

There is nothing that can be done.

Re: The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

#117
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s always been the same answer for hundreds of years. Unions and solidarity.

But don’t you know? We are exceptional. Unions are for the plebs. /s But of course the reality is tech workers are the plebs too, far closer to the median than to capital elite. Treasured illusions die hard. Unions enjoy 71% public support and organizing is federally protected activity. The minority isn’t stopping anyone, they can be safely ignored. (My note: I recognize I will never be obscenely wealthy; it does not…

The perks of FAANG are there, IMO, to pay the employees with a feeling of high-class status. Meanwhile, from an economic-class perspective, engineering is essentially blue-collar - it’s mostly about things and not (directly) about people. It’s a weird dichotomy.

Re: The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

#118
post #97

This isn't particularly well-argued. Just a lot of handwavy grievance about "elites" as though there's some kind of coordinated conspiracy.

Kind of an "Ugh, Capitalism" take - https://www.infinitescroll.us/p/ugh-capitalism

Weren't people right about this though? Institutionalized racism and sexism was everywhere, neoliberalism created the most unequal society since the era we unironically call "the robber-baron era", the carceral system is truly heinous (the ban on weed alone was just a joke), etc etc etc.

Re: The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

#119
post #24

How are "the elite" forcing companies that do not own real estate and who rent their office space to mandate RTO? How are they forcing these companies to renew their leases when they expire?

It's sunk cost. They have CRE leases they can't back out of and want to leverage their expensive real estate.

In the future as the leases expire we may see shrinking and a slow return to more remote work as companies reduce the square footage of the leases.

Smart managers know that eliminating rent from balance sheets improves the bottom line.

Re: The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

#120
post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Kind of an "Ugh, Capitalism" take - https://www.infinitescroll.us/p/ugh-capitalism

Weren't people right about this though? Institutionalized racism and sexism was everywhere, neoliberalism created the most unequal society since the era we unironically call "the robber-baron era", the carceral system is truly heinous (the ban on weed alone was just a joke), etc etc etc.

Sure, there are all sorts of problems with capitalism. But as Churchill said about democracy, it the worst form of economic organization except for all the others that have been tried from time to time.
Post reply on HN