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The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

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Re: The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

#51

Post by vasco »

roncesvalles wrote: post #39
jpollock wrote: post #7

If your job can be done remote, it can be done offshore for 1/10 the cost.

If your job isn't remote, it can also be offshored for 1/10 the cost - just get an office building. The arbitrage from offshoring is much narrower than most people think. You mostly get what you pay for and companies can easily waste a lot of money and time trying to go the low-cost more-employees route.

That's not true, the amount of US based scale-up jobs in Europe has risen a lot in the last couple of years also bringing up compensation at the top end to a bit higher than you used to be able to get here.

Re: The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

#52

Post by itronitron »

8b16380d wrote: post #2

What recourse do we as workers have? We can soft boycott and quit/stop applying to onsite positions, but there are hundreds of thousands willing and able to take these positions.

Ride a bike, take the bus, report sexual harassment by managers, microwave fish dumplings for lunch if your in the office, etc.

Re: The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

#53

Post by relyks »

This argument may not realistically apply to larger companies in the same way, especially those that don't own their office spaces and have longer-term leases of 5-10 years or more. The dynamics are different for larger companies located in major city centers like NYC, where commercial leases tend to be longer term.

Smaller companies with shorter-term leases likely have more flexibility and control over their spaces, so the argument could hold more weight for them. Larger enterprises are more anchored to their existing offices and long-term leases, limiting their ability to quickly shed or change office footprints.

Re: The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

#54

Post by typon »

jpollock wrote: post #7

If your job can be done remote, it can be done offshore for 1/10 the cost.

The market is simultaneously efficient and yet refuses to offshore absolutely every job to make more money and increase profits. Strange world we live in.

Re: The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

#55

Post by FirmwareBurner »

sundaeofshock wrote: post #3
8b16380d wrote: post #2

What recourse do we as workers have? We can soft boycott and quit/stop applying to onsite positions, but there are hundreds of thousands willing and able to take these positions.

Unions.

>Unions.

From my recent experience, unions can't help you keep remote work they way they work here today. I work(ed) at a unionized German company and when management call everyone back to the office after the Covid vaccination was done, it wasn't protested by the unions and everyone sowed up at the office without protest, and remote work was kept as "in case of emergency" perk you can get every now and then if you get approval from your manager beforehand.

Unions here only serve the purpose to intervene in case of major force like discrimination, health and safety, layoffs, working hours, overtime, and the negociate mandatory yearly pay increases based on inflation and company profits, not help you keep your desired perk of not commuting to the office as the office is seen as the mandatory place of work by contract, not your home, so physical presence at work part is usually non-negotiable.

Actually, unions here are relatively against remote work or at least quiet on the topic, as they assume it'll lead to easier off-shoring in the long run (already happening anyway) and the loss of their jobs , so on-site presence of the workforce is considered as an advantage in convincing the company to keep invested in Germany and not move abroad (generals like seeing their soldiers at work where their money is goes).

Re: The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

#56

Post by Jcampuzano2 »

jpollock wrote: post #7

If your job can be done remote, it can be done offshore for 1/10 the cost.

If across the board all work that could be remote were 1/10 cost with no downside, literally every job that could be remote would already be offshored at this point already.

Re: The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

#57

Post by Mountain_Skies »

8b16380d wrote: post #2

What recourse do we as workers have? We can soft boycott and quit/stop applying to onsite positions, but there are hundreds of thousands willing and able to take these positions.

The labor market overall is tight but tech is in an employment recession so employers currently have power. Do what you need to do to put yourself in a position where you can bail and jump to a remote employer at the first opportunity. If the majority does this, companies will have to change or die. Going back to the office because of the current power dynamic is ok but getting complacent and not using your most powerful weapon, jumping to another job, is now the RTO folks win longterm.

Re: The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

#58

Post by kristjansson »

This seems needlessly class-war-monegring. People slack off at home, people slack off in the office. Everyone’s situation is not your situation. Everyone’s work does not look like your work. Some people like/want/need office space to work, some people don’t. Some people find themselves in different camps on different days.

In any case, companies driving RTO are acting in their own perceived best interests, not their landlords. Either they’re so beholden to CRE that their landlords best interests are their best interests (eg some law firms, maybe architects, ?), reasoning against sunk costs of their existing long-term leases, playing some petty power-game, or seeing some actual benefit to hybrid/in-office schedules. Some of those seem more likely than others, but all seem more likely than all managers being part of an elite cabal and doing it as a favor to their elite-cabal friends with CRE interests.

Re: The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

#59

Post by olalonde »

ikekkdcjkfke wrote: post #42
skwirl wrote: post #24

How are "the elite" forcing companies that do not own real estate and who rent their office space to mandate RTO? How are they forcing these companies to renew their leases when they expire?

I have no proof but i would think share holder power?

It was a rhetorical question. They don't and it's a flawed theory.

Re: The elite's war on remote work has nothing to do with productivity

#60

Post by praptak »

ikekkdcjkfke wrote: post #42
skwirl wrote: post #24

How are "the elite" forcing companies that do not own real estate and who rent their office space to mandate RTO? How are they forcing these companies to renew their leases when they expire?

I have no proof but i would think share holder power?

Google has full control by Brin and Page and still has RTO. This theory doesn't hold water.
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