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Turns out lowly thymus may be saving your life

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Re: Turns out lowly thymus may be saving your life

#51
post #35

This type article declaring a thymus revelation is published every few years. We've known the thymus is saving our lives — it's where the t in t-Cells derives from for years. There are very old studies of removing it from older humans and statistically seeing a decline in health. Most doctors will not remove it without a decent cause in older patients (intractable infection, for example). In those cases it's not that…

I wish I could say my dad's thymus is saving his life, quite the opposite. He was discharged from the ICU/hospital yesterday after he nearly died from a "myasthenic crisis"—an event that most people with Myasthenia Gravis (MG) will experience. From what I understand, his thymus produces antibodies that destroys receptors connecting the nerves and muscles. He can't keep his head up, eyelids up, can't swallow and durin…

My mother was diagnosed with MG 25 years ago. Her first symptoms were droopy eyelid and double vision. Plasmapheresis helped, Prednisone had nasty side effects (glad to hear that sounds not to be the case for your father), prismatic glasses to un-double her vision kind of helped?

As her symptoms increased—-speech delay, difficulty swallowing, eye misalignment, all stemming from fatigue-induced nerve conduction delays which can culminate in respiratory failure—-myasthenic crisis, they opted for thymectomy (open surgery). She was probably 50 and while the recovery was lengthy, it drastically improved her symptoms and the amount of activity she could do before arose symptoms appeared. No more prism glasses or multi-second speech delays, or weekly plasmapheresis visits. If she spent too much time being active or driving on a sunny day (squinting), she’d feel the ocular fatigue first and know she had to rest or take a prednisone. Now her eyes are failing for other reasons but the thymectomy bought her 25 years and counting.

I’m glad your father survived his crisis. It sounds like you’re doing all of the conservative treatments (which is good; steroid noncompliance is a risk factor for crisis).

There are new medications that directly reduce or deactivate AChR antibodies. Non-invasive video-assisted thoracoscopic thymectomy is more viable today too (and thymectomy has been shown to decrease the frequency and severity of crises even where the thymus was considered normal). Plasmapheresis remains generally effective, if time consuming.

MG sucks. From one son to another, I hope you can get a few more good decades with your parent too.

Re: Turns out lowly thymus may be saving your life

#52
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe that the appendix is now understood to be a store for gut flora so that the microbiome can regrow after an infection or bad episode of diarrhoea etc.

I believe it’s only posited to be useful for isolated small groups where everyone might get the same stomach bug at the same time, and have no other humans around with a healthy gut biome to “re-infect” them. Which explains why in dense modern society we couldn’t find a difference that the appendix makes, because we get reinfected with healthy microbiome from sharing germs with all the other humans in our big cities…

> Which explains why in dense modern society we couldn’t find a difference that the appendix makes, because we get reinfected with healthy microbiome from sharing germs with all the other humans in our big cities - some of whom didn’t just get a terrible stomach bug at the same time as us.

Do you have any citations for that? Perhaps it differs by city and region, but many modern cities with good sanitation systems are exceptionally clean - you're not getting frequently reinfected by others' gut flora unless there is a catastrophic problem with the sewer system. People with things like C. difficile infection can have chronic disease for years, and fecal transplants have only recently been recognized as a good treatment in those cases - point being you have to have an actual fecal transplant, you're not just going to "get reinfected with healthy microbiome from sharing germs with all the other humans".

Re: Turns out lowly thymus may be saving your life

#53
post #30
post #23

This is a fluff piece. We've known for decades that the thymus is an important part of the immune system. It's not an organ that's been believed to be vestigial, like the appendix. > For the study, Kooshesh mined data from 1,146 adult patients who had undergone thymus removal, alongside demographically matched control patients who had undergone similar surgeries but kept their thymus Sure, you can demographically mat…

I believe that the appendix is now understood to be a store for gut flora so that the microbiome can regrow after an infection or bad episode of diarrhoea etc.

That is my understanding. Same function as tonsils.

Re: Turns out lowly thymus may be saving your life

#54
post #23

This is a fluff piece. We've known for decades that the thymus is an important part of the immune system. It's not an organ that's been believed to be vestigial, like the appendix. > For the study, Kooshesh mined data from 1,146 adult patients who had undergone thymus removal, alongside demographically matched control patients who had undergone similar surgeries but kept their thymus Sure, you can demographically mat…

> It's not an organ that's been believed to be vestigial, like the appendix.

Not vestigial evolutionary speaking, but doesn't it get less and less functional over a person's lifespan and gets replaced with fat tissue?

Re: Turns out lowly thymus may be saving your life

#55
post #2

I've always felt us removing things like tonsils and appendix without a high barrier was always premature. I remember kids wanting to have their tonsils removed to eat ice cream for a few weeks. lol. Even if we have legacy parts in out body, I'm fine just letting it fester in my body as long as it's not trying to kill me. Feels very similar to thinking farming just needs 3 nutrients. Turns out better farming requires…

> I've always felt us removing things like tonsils and appendix without a high barrier was always premature.

Add circumcisions to the list.

Re: Turns out lowly thymus may be saving your life

#56
post #30
post #23

This is a fluff piece. We've known for decades that the thymus is an important part of the immune system. It's not an organ that's been believed to be vestigial, like the appendix. > For the study, Kooshesh mined data from 1,146 adult patients who had undergone thymus removal, alongside demographically matched control patients who had undergone similar surgeries but kept their thymus Sure, you can demographically mat…

I believe that the appendix is now understood to be a store for gut flora so that the microbiome can regrow after an infection or bad episode of diarrhoea etc.

You are correct. The Wikipedia page has a diagram explaining the process [0].

[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appendix_(anatomy)#/media/File...

Re: Turns out lowly thymus may be saving your life

#58
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe that the appendix is now understood to be a store for gut flora so that the microbiome can regrow after an infection or bad episode of diarrhoea etc.

I believe it’s only posited to be useful for isolated small groups where everyone might get the same stomach bug at the same time, and have no other humans around with a healthy gut biome to “re-infect” them. Which explains why in dense modern society we couldn’t find a difference that the appendix makes, because we get reinfected with healthy microbiome from sharing germs with all the other humans in our big cities…

If true, lockdowns would have had an effect on those without an appendix?

It would be interest to see how historically contact with X other people has changed over time. I don’t think you need a big city to mix with a lot of people. I imagine in older times there are fewer people but likely to be closer to each other - people sharing beds (not stupidly associating bed with sex) and tribes of families mingling close lower instead of nuclear family. By contrast the city apartment is the hermetic seal around a small number of people choosing to live together. But a modern concept: corporations, jobs and careers ensure people keep mixing up with people outside.

Re: Turns out lowly thymus may be saving your life

#59
post #23

This is a fluff piece. We've known for decades that the thymus is an important part of the immune system. It's not an organ that's been believed to be vestigial, like the appendix. > For the study, Kooshesh mined data from 1,146 adult patients who had undergone thymus removal, alongside demographically matched control patients who had undergone similar surgeries but kept their thymus Sure, you can demographically mat…

Recently, while on my usual documentaries watch, I learnt that the appendix may no longer be considered appendix.

From Wikipedia[1], “The appendix was once considered a vestigial organ, but this view has changed since the early 2000s. Research suggests that the appendix may serve an important purpose as a reservoir for beneficial gut bacteria.”

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appendix_(anatomy)

Re: Turns out lowly thymus may be saving your life

#60
post #2

I've always felt us removing things like tonsils and appendix without a high barrier was always premature. I remember kids wanting to have their tonsils removed to eat ice cream for a few weeks. lol. Even if we have legacy parts in out body, I'm fine just letting it fester in my body as long as it's not trying to kill me. Feels very similar to thinking farming just needs 3 nutrients. Turns out better farming requires…

> I've always felt us removing things like tonsils and appendix without a high barrier was always premature. Add circumcisions to the list.

There was never a medical reason for those, only religious. American doctors tried to invent a medical reason, but those are the same doctors who told people that smoking is good for you because the tobacco companies paid them to.
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