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Your computer should say what you tell it to say

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Re: Your computer should say what you tell it to say

#81

Post by freedomben »

tailspin2019 wrote: post #8
barbariangrunge wrote: post #7

Remember: upvoting the EFF's articles is good, but you (yes, you!) can also donate to them to help with these campaigns!

Agreed. I have a lot of respect for the work they do. They make some cool merch too: https://supporters.eff.org/donate/

Can anyone speak to the quality of the shirts? I bought one many years ago at a Linux conference and the design was cool but the shirt itself feels like cardboard and sandpaper, so I never wear it.

If the shirts are Bella Canvas or American Life or something else high quality, I'd happily buy some. Tshirts are a great way to raise funds IMHO, and the EFF is doing extremely important work and needs to be funded.

Re: Your computer should say what you tell it to say

#82

Post by hot_gril »

sdedovic wrote: post #49
endisneigh wrote: post #25

I read the entire thing and it’s not clear how this reduces control of your own computer. It seems the premise is that those with a computer should be able to access others servers wholesale unconditionally. This premise is obviously wrong. > It also raises the barrier to entry for new browsers, something Google employees acknowledged in an unofficial explainer for the new feature, Web Environment Integrity (WEI). Th…

Imagine this: You buy a house. Your house has a little box by the front door. The box holds a small House Environment Integrity (HEI) module. This HEI is something your local Home Owners Association installed. They say you cannot open the box or investigate how the module inside works, as this is against the HOA and you will be fined. They tell you this HEI module is meant to help and protect you. To make sure the pl…

Instead of imagining a theoretical box, consider the water and power meters you probably already have that you don't technically own.

Re: Your computer should say what you tell it to say

#83

Post by JohnFen »

nightpool wrote: post #26
tapoxi wrote: post #10

I mean, devil's advocate here, this tech already exists and the question is do we do client attestation in a browser or pretend remote attestation doesn't exist. If this gets rejected, would that mean that services that need a "trusted client" simply deprecate their web apps and rely on a iOS/Android app? I'm not trying to argue in favor of WEI, I just think this doesn't magically disappear if Google doesn't implemen…

I would suggest reading the TAG's Web Platform Design Principles document, it does a really good job laying out why the web is different from mobile and native applications and the reasons why some APIs, like client attestation, work in a mobile environment but would damage the web platform if they're implemented. For example, the WEI proposal violates the "It should be safe to visit a web page" principle ( https://w…

> I know a lot of savvy, non-technical users who absolutely refuse to install mobile apps on their phone

Yes. Mobile apps are far too risky, in my opinion. These days, the only ones I install are ones that I've written myself.

Re: Your computer should say what you tell it to say

#84

Post by dmoy »

dmoy wrote: post #16
local_issues wrote: post #2

The EFF stands alone in its commitment to actually speaking truth to power. The ACLU has become just another arm of the DNC, same with the SPLC etc - repeating CNN-esque talking points. Same with the NRA - milquetoast arm of those in power. The EFF will go after orgs that fund it, which requires true compunction. FIRE is a good replacement for the ACLU, FYI. And John Brown Gun Club is becoming a better NRA.

> John Brown Gun Club is becoming a better NRA. JBCG doesn't really replace much of the NRA. Even if hypothetically people could join JBCG at mass scale, which they can't due to the way its structured. The NRA-ILA is increasingly useless for 2A advocacy and legal efforts, but JBCG isn't replacing that at all. FPC, 2AF, to a lesser extent GOA do more there. NRA courses are crufty but don't really have a replacement ap…

> What JBCG has that the NRA doesn't, and never had,

(Corollary: maybe that makes them a "better NRA", but it's an odd statement to look at because it sounds something like "DuckDuckGo is becoming a better Nvidia". Yes both are computer-adjacent, but they do completely different things, and have roughly never had any overlap in activities)

Re: Your computer should say what you tell it to say

#85

Post by mig39 »

version_five wrote: post #68
HPsquared wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

See also the history of railroads and telecoms.

Also every industry in Canada

The solution in Canada is to break up some of these huge companies. The free market can solve things, but only if there's a free market. When you have 1 or 2 companies, there's no competition.

Re: Your computer should say what you tell it to say

#86

Post by j-bos »

sdedovic wrote: post #49
endisneigh wrote: post #25

I read the entire thing and it’s not clear how this reduces control of your own computer. It seems the premise is that those with a computer should be able to access others servers wholesale unconditionally. This premise is obviously wrong. > It also raises the barrier to entry for new browsers, something Google employees acknowledged in an unofficial explainer for the new feature, Web Environment Integrity (WEI). Th…

Imagine this: You buy a house. Your house has a little box by the front door. The box holds a small House Environment Integrity (HEI) module. This HEI is something your local Home Owners Association installed. They say you cannot open the box or investigate how the module inside works, as this is against the HOA and you will be fined. They tell you this HEI module is meant to help and protect you. To make sure the pl…

> This does not reduce the control of your own house.

Just make sure your visiting friends register with the HOA, and don't get excited about being handy with the curtains, that's gonna require an HOA approved contractor.

Re: Your computer should say what you tell it to say

#88

Post by JohnFen »

minerva23 wrote: post #22
barbariangrunge wrote: post #7

Remember: upvoting the EFF's articles is good, but you (yes, you!) can also donate to them to help with these campaigns!

I had donated to the EFF in the past, but their stance[1] that CDNs/hosted services shouldn't be allowed to choose the customers they are willing work with is not only wrong, it's causes harm[2]. [1] https://www.eff.org/press/releases/international-coalition-r... [2] https://blog.cloudflare.com/kiwifarms-blocked/

I'm a strong supporter of EFF -- but you know what? I don't agree with every position they take. I can't think of any organization (or person) that I agree with 100%. If perfect alignment with my worldview were a prerequisite, I'd be unable to support anything or anyone.

Instead, I look at the total effect. On the whole, EFF (in my opinion) does far more good than ill, so they have my support.

Re: Your computer should say what you tell it to say

#89

Post by clucas »

nologic01 wrote: post #42

> A handful of companies have established chokepoints between buyers and sellers, performers and audiences, workers and employers, as well as families and communities. When those companies refuse to deal with you, your digital life grinds to a halt This short paragraph summarizes the (ex-ante) improbably unusual situation we have drifted into. The negatively affected stakeholders being enumerated are more or less the…

> as if they already operate effective mind control at systemic scale.

If the logical conclusion of your reasoning is a mass mind control conspiracy, you should revisit your assumptions.

> somehow they can bully into submission basically the entire universe

I don't think anyone is bullying all of society. I think most people just don't care. It's really not that crazy, no mind control involved. Just good old fashioned apathy and ignorance.

Re: Your computer should say what you tell it to say

#90

Post by ncallaway »

wilsonnb3 wrote: post #76
sdedovic wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imagine this: You buy a house. Your house has a little box by the front door. The box holds a small House Environment Integrity (HEI) module. This HEI is something your local Home Owners Association installed. They say you cannot open the box or investigate how the module inside works, as this is against the HOA and you will be fined. They tell you this HEI module is meant to help and protect you. To make sure the pl…

This is an argument against the TPM, not WEI.

Sure, WEI just says that they’ll allow literally any person you interact with at all look in the box on your house.
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