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Tesla, Inc. 8-k filing – CFO leaves Tesla

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Re: Tesla, Inc. 8-k filing – CFO leaves Tesla

#71

Post by bluefishinit »

wonderwonder wrote: post #61
lyapunova wrote: post #38

Whether the CFO leaving is a "canary" or not, I think there is ample evidence that Tesla's overall value proposition is grossly misaligned with its current valuation (futures priced-in). I would not blame people for using this as an excuse to weaken their positions on Tesla. I am invested and have been for almost a decade, for the record.

How much of Tesla do you think is Musk? For example, if Zuck choked Musk to death in a cage fight, what do you think would happen to the stock? Obviously the odds of this happening are close to 0 but after investing heavily in Tesla I came to the conclusion (perhaps wrongly) that a good deal of the value in tesla stock is tied to Musk. He could get hit by a bus tomorrow. So I sold and put it all in an index fund that…

> How much of Tesla do you think is Musk?

Tesla's valuation is mostly Musk. "Infinite demand", "full self-driving"... the SEC should have cracked down on him a long time ago but they seem unwilling to do so. Ultimately reality will win out and Tesla's stock will realign. That hasn't happened because Musk has an army of fanboys he can use to pump the stock, apparent ins at the SEC and a very aggressive call buying program on Tesla. I don't think anyone other than Musk could get away with pumping the stock like he has, so the valuation is mostly dependent on him.

Re: Tesla, Inc. 8-k filing – CFO leaves Tesla

#72

Post by NotYourLawyer »

hypeit wrote: post #46
NotYourLawyer wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

When the CEO makes a bunch of fraudulent statements, that is actually bad. It's one thing for people to change jobs, it's another when the guy who is the direct line of fire from Musk's lies leaves. The market can stay irrational for a long time, but at some point reality will enter the equation.

He’s been in that position for 13 years. It’s not like anything Musk is doing is new.

Re: Tesla, Inc. 8-k filing – CFO leaves Tesla

#73

Post by lyapunova »

wonderwonder wrote: post #61
lyapunova wrote: post #38

Whether the CFO leaving is a "canary" or not, I think there is ample evidence that Tesla's overall value proposition is grossly misaligned with its current valuation (futures priced-in). I would not blame people for using this as an excuse to weaken their positions on Tesla. I am invested and have been for almost a decade, for the record.

How much of Tesla do you think is Musk? For example, if Zuck choked Musk to death in a cage fight, what do you think would happen to the stock? Obviously the odds of this happening are close to 0 but after investing heavily in Tesla I came to the conclusion (perhaps wrongly) that a good deal of the value in tesla stock is tied to Musk. He could get hit by a bus tomorrow. So I sold and put it all in an index fund that…

I have never let the existence of Elon swing my decision making too much one way or the other.

As others have pointed out, he has some qualities that making him a major asset and some that make him a liability.

Since you asked specifically about Elon, I think he is best at launching companies via the SV playbook, but not as well-suited for sustaining mid-to-latestage companies that aim to serve as industry cornerstones (with some exception allotted for SpaceX). The pattern I have seen is the underlying layers of the companies he spearheads early on typically erode due to rapid accumulation of both technical and cultural debt.

Re: Tesla, Inc. 8-k filing – CFO leaves Tesla

#74

Post by OJFord »

woah wrote: post #52
frankreyes wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah but nobody cares about HP and their silly printers. Also, Elon doesn't have anything to do with HP

Your Tesla's battery cartridge is low on ink. Please replace your Tesla battery cartridge with a certified genuine replacement cartridge at the nearest Tesla dealership.

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Re: Tesla, Inc. 8-k filing – CFO leaves Tesla

#75

Post by hypeit »

unusualmonkey wrote: post #70
hypeit wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I welcome the day where we treat business less seriously. Teslas can and do kill people. Taking business "less seriously" is how you do things like remove lidar and label the hobbled driver assist as "full self-driving". I doubt people who have had family members killed by a Tesla think these titles are cute and "fun".

Can you prove any connection between the two?

You mean between not taking business seriously and making choices that put people's lives in danger? He was told by his team lidar was a better solution and on a whim he killed it, that's a pretty big connection!

Re: Tesla, Inc. 8-k filing – CFO leaves Tesla

#76

Post by Ryder123 »

dvt wrote: post #24
pdq wrote: post #15

Not good when a CFO abruptly resigns (or is fired). Usually companies project this quarters ahead to the public, with a soft notice that "XYZ will be retiring next year". Yes, Kirkhorn "will continue to serve Tesla through the end of the year to support a seamless transition", but this reads as a rush notice. His IR page is also gone: https://ir.tesla.com/corporate/zachary-kirkhorn

> Yes, Kirkhorn "will continue to serve Tesla through the end of the year to support a seamless transition", but this reads as a rush notice. I don't own any $TSLA (or one of their cars), but this is like the opposite of a rush notice. Heck, he will continue working for Tesla for almost half the year. Seems like typical HN "everything Elon does is bad" bandwagoning. I mean, just earlier today the HP CFO resigned[1] a…

Do we know whether "the end of the year" is the fiscal year or calendar year? Given the context fiscal year seems very plausible, and that's less than 2 months away.

Re: Tesla, Inc. 8-k filing – CFO leaves Tesla

#77

Post by _ea1k »

Kranar wrote: post #30
pdq wrote: post #15

Not good when a CFO abruptly resigns (or is fired). Usually companies project this quarters ahead to the public, with a soft notice that "XYZ will be retiring next year". Yes, Kirkhorn "will continue to serve Tesla through the end of the year to support a seamless transition", but this reads as a rush notice. His IR page is also gone: https://ir.tesla.com/corporate/zachary-kirkhorn

Just to put things in context, the average tenure of a CFO among S&P 500 companies is 3.5 years. I don't think that's a big deal, but apparently people commenting here think a CFO departing is some kind of major signal of something. At any rate, it's at least worth knowing quantitatively that this happens once every 4 years or so.

The only part that surprises me is that he's so young and leaving this quickly. I can't see him retiring, so what looks more appealing right now?

Re: Tesla, Inc. 8-k filing – CFO leaves Tesla

#78

Post by unusualmonkey »

hypeit wrote: post #75
unusualmonkey wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you prove any connection between the two?

You mean between not taking business seriously and making choices that put people's lives in danger? He was told by his team lidar was a better solution and on a whim he killed it, that's a pretty big connection!

You've not established that has anything to do with titles. Nor have you established killing lidar was a bad idea, or puts people's lives in danger.

Remember that hype isn't the same as substance.

Re: Tesla, Inc. 8-k filing – CFO leaves Tesla

#79

Post by Spooky23 »

wonderwonder wrote: post #61
lyapunova wrote: post #38

Whether the CFO leaving is a "canary" or not, I think there is ample evidence that Tesla's overall value proposition is grossly misaligned with its current valuation (futures priced-in). I would not blame people for using this as an excuse to weaken their positions on Tesla. I am invested and have been for almost a decade, for the record.

How much of Tesla do you think is Musk? For example, if Zuck choked Musk to death in a cage fight, what do you think would happen to the stock? Obviously the odds of this happening are close to 0 but after investing heavily in Tesla I came to the conclusion (perhaps wrongly) that a good deal of the value in tesla stock is tied to Musk. He could get hit by a bus tomorrow. So I sold and put it all in an index fund that…

Musk is willing to make reckless decisions and avoid expensive complications like following the law. A normal car executive would never just break the law re direct sales etc.

I’d guess he’s becoming less valuable as the company is larger. Twitter is the textbook example of the downside of ruling by whim.

Re: Tesla, Inc. 8-k filing – CFO leaves Tesla

#80

Post by hypeit »

NotYourLawyer wrote: post #72
hypeit wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When the CEO makes a bunch of fraudulent statements, that is actually bad. It's one thing for people to change jobs, it's another when the guy who is the direct line of fire from Musk's lies leaves. The market can stay irrational for a long time, but at some point reality will enter the equation.

He’s been in that position for 13 years. It’s not like anything Musk is doing is new.

You can only keep the corruption going for so long. Maybe there's someone new at the SEC that will actually go after him, maybe the shareholder have finally had enough. It could be anything but the CFO headed for the door in a company notorious for fraud speaks to a potential reckoning.
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