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Developer Tools in Firefox 11 - 3D DOM Inspector and Live Style Editor

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Re: Developer Tools in Firefox 11 - 3D DOM Inspector and Live Style Editor

#11

Post by SquareWheel »

kamjam wrote: post #10
malux85 wrote: post #3

Doing things right / Doing the right things. They're doing the wrong things here. Firefox is dog slow compared to Chrome. Firefox: I loved you for a few years, but now I fondly remember Firefox 3.5 as "It was better than I.E" ... my new love is Chrome, because Chrome is at my doorstep asking where can it take me, while you're still getting out of bed in the morning.

Same here, but I still can't get away with NOT using Firefox but only due to Firebug. I just can't get to grips with chrome's dev tools, but it may be a habit thing. And Firebug for Chrome is just "Lite" really.

Is there any particular functionality you're missing? Chrome Dev Tools are really comparable in my opinion. I would like a way to tamper data sent in POST, but I don't think even Firebug has that built in.

Re: Developer Tools in Firefox 11 - 3D DOM Inspector and Live Style Editor

#12

Post by robin_reala »

malux85 wrote: post #3

Doing things right / Doing the right things. They're doing the wrong things here. Firefox is dog slow compared to Chrome. Firefox: I loved you for a few years, but now I fondly remember Firefox 3.5 as "It was better than I.E" ... my new love is Chrome, because Chrome is at my doorstep asking where can it take me, while you're still getting out of bed in the morning.

Firefox shouldn’t be massively slower than Chrome for day-to-day use. The usual advice here: turn off extensions that you’re not actively using. If it’s still slow then you could consider making a new profile, which usually speeds stuff up.

http://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/Managing-profiles

Re: Developer Tools in Firefox 11 - 3D DOM Inspector and Live Style Editor

#13

Post by lean »

3D View: Neat, but I'll never use it

Live CSS editing: You're now as good as Firebug, great.

Save CSS changes: This is awesome, we just need a plugin that takes it a step further, automatically updating the local/remote files when I click "Save", instead of having to save each file one at a time, and browse the folder structure to find them each time

Re: Developer Tools in Firefox 11 - 3D DOM Inspector and Live Style Editor

#14

Post by crowleysimon »

malux85 wrote: post #3

Doing things right / Doing the right things. They're doing the wrong things here. Firefox is dog slow compared to Chrome. Firefox: I loved you for a few years, but now I fondly remember Firefox 3.5 as "It was better than I.E" ... my new love is Chrome, because Chrome is at my doorstep asking where can it take me, while you're still getting out of bed in the morning.

"During 2011, we saw the latest Firefox release that year being up to 7 times faster than Firefox 3.6!"

"A lot of work went into this area, and there were improvements resulting in up to 50% less memory usage."

Source(https://hacks.mozilla.org/2012/03/firefox-in-2011-firefox-pl...)

Personally I don't get the whole fast/slow argument it seems people bring up every time a web browser is mentioned. They all seem to perform comparably. I use firefox only because it allows me to group and hide my ~80 tabs and only loads the ones i'm using.

Re: Developer Tools in Firefox 11 - 3D DOM Inspector and Live Style Editor

#15

Post by meow »

SquareWheel wrote: post #11
kamjam wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same here, but I still can't get away with NOT using Firefox but only due to Firebug. I just can't get to grips with chrome's dev tools, but it may be a habit thing. And Firebug for Chrome is just "Lite" really.

Is there any particular functionality you're missing? Chrome Dev Tools are really comparable in my opinion. I would like a way to tamper data sent in POST, but I don't think even Firebug has that built in.

It's those minor but intuitive things that we get used to when using firebug. For example: 1) The inspect tool is at the bottom on chrome dev tools. It would have been much more intuitive to keep it at the top of the bar.

2) You don't see a change of cursor when hovering over editable properties. People who never used firebug might have gotten used to this but for me it feels clunky.

3) No single click edit. On firebug you can start editing a property with a single click. Not so on chrome. This is even worse when editing styles. When single clicking a style you don't even see a visual indication that something happened... again feels clunky..

4)Too many tabs that are not bunched according to how often they are used.. I don't think people use Resources, Timeline, Profiles, Audits as often as they use the other tabs.

5) The information is presented in more readable way. When a break point is hit, chrome displays a bunch of tabs on right which are vertical (often empty - because they aren't relevant to this break point) and wasting precious vertical space..

6) Clutter, clutter and more clutter.. just too many sub windows cramped into one another affecting readability...

I know that most of these reasons are subjective and vary across developers but wanted make a list of my own reasons as I found my self trying to use chrome dev tools and always jumping back to firebug.

Re: Developer Tools in Firefox 11 - 3D DOM Inspector and Live Style Editor

#16

Post by kamjam »

meow wrote: post #15
SquareWheel wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there any particular functionality you're missing? Chrome Dev Tools are really comparable in my opinion. I would like a way to tamper data sent in POST, but I don't think even Firebug has that built in.

It's those minor but intuitive things that we get used to when using firebug. For example: 1) The inspect tool is at the bottom on chrome dev tools. It would have been much more intuitive to keep it at the top of the bar. 2) You don't see a change of cursor when hovering over editable properties. People who never used firebug might have gotten used to this but for me it feels clunky. 3) No single click edit. On fireb…

Yes, this is pretty much it. I think it's more a habits thing than anything and I will have to force myself (at some point) to jump ship completely unless I see some improvement from FF. I understand Firebug, I just need to be able to fully map those onto Chrome, so need to spend a few hours re-learning.

Only other thing I need/want is the FireQuery plugin to help with any jQuery development.

Re: Developer Tools in Firefox 11 - 3D DOM Inspector and Live Style Editor

#17

Post by crazygringo »

robin_reala wrote: post #12
malux85 wrote: post #3

Doing things right / Doing the right things. They're doing the wrong things here. Firefox is dog slow compared to Chrome. Firefox: I loved you for a few years, but now I fondly remember Firefox 3.5 as "It was better than I.E" ... my new love is Chrome, because Chrome is at my doorstep asking where can it take me, while you're still getting out of bed in the morning.

Firefox shouldn’t be massively slower than Chrome for day-to-day use. The usual advice here: turn off extensions that you’re not actively using. If it’s still slow then you could consider making a new profile, which usually speeds stuff up. http://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/Managing-profiles

I never understand people who say Firefox is as fast as Chrome. It's nowhere close, and can't be.

My normal use case is to open 15 tabs, all at once, from a single page (e.g. Hacker News homepage).

Firefox is single-threaded, as far as I know, and the whole interface freezes while it does the heavy lifting in loading the contents for each new tab. It takes me 30 seconds total of waiting 2-3 seconds for each tab to load, just so I can scroll/click on a new link.

Whereas with Chrome, I just breeze through clicking on all the links, it takes 5 seconds total, and every other tab starts loading on separate threads. I can switch to the loaded ones instantly.

This has nothing to do with extensions, and everything to do with the fact that Chrome has a separate UI thread and separate threads per-tab.

Please correct me if anything I'm saying is wrong...

Re: Developer Tools in Firefox 11 - 3D DOM Inspector and Live Style Editor

#18

Post by crazygringo »

meow wrote: post #15
SquareWheel wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there any particular functionality you're missing? Chrome Dev Tools are really comparable in my opinion. I would like a way to tamper data sent in POST, but I don't think even Firebug has that built in.

It's those minor but intuitive things that we get used to when using firebug. For example: 1) The inspect tool is at the bottom on chrome dev tools. It would have been much more intuitive to keep it at the top of the bar. 2) You don't see a change of cursor when hovering over editable properties. People who never used firebug might have gotten used to this but for me it feels clunky. 3) No single click edit. On fireb…

The tiny little detail that drives me nuts is that, in Chrome, to disable a CSS rule, the checkbox is on the right side of the rule, not the left.

The problem is that I can't visually tell which checkboxes match which rules, because they're too far away. Even worse, the checkboxes only show up on hover, and disappear when you hover just one pixel to the right of them, because the hover area is set wrong. (At least on OSX.)

It's just all the little details the Firebug gets right, and Chrome doesn't seem to, but day after day, they add up.

Re: Developer Tools in Firefox 11 - 3D DOM Inspector and Live Style Editor

#19

Post by robin_reala »

crazygringo wrote: post #17
robin_reala wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firefox shouldn’t be massively slower than Chrome for day-to-day use. The usual advice here: turn off extensions that you’re not actively using. If it’s still slow then you could consider making a new profile, which usually speeds stuff up. http://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/Managing-profiles

I never understand people who say Firefox is as fast as Chrome. It's nowhere close, and can't be. My normal use case is to open 15 tabs, all at once, from a single page (e.g. Hacker News homepage). Firefox is single-threaded, as far as I know, and the whole interface freezes while it does the heavy lifting in loading the contents for each new tab. It takes me 30 seconds total of waiting 2-3 seconds for each tab to lo…

I just tried your experiment on Chrome and yep, it was faster than Firefox, but by no means was Firefox slow. Sure, the UI slowed down a touch for the few seconds it took to load the pages (framerate dropped while I scrolled up and down) but it wasn’t unusable and I definitely didn’t have to wait 30 seconds - didn’t have to wait at all.

Maybe I’ve just got a decent-spec machine here at work (quad i5, 12gb ram)…

Re: Developer Tools in Firefox 11 - 3D DOM Inspector and Live Style Editor

#20

Post by [deleted] »

meow wrote: post #15
SquareWheel wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there any particular functionality you're missing? Chrome Dev Tools are really comparable in my opinion. I would like a way to tamper data sent in POST, but I don't think even Firebug has that built in.

It's those minor but intuitive things that we get used to when using firebug. For example: 1) The inspect tool is at the bottom on chrome dev tools. It would have been much more intuitive to keep it at the top of the bar. 2) You don't see a change of cursor when hovering over editable properties. People who never used firebug might have gotten used to this but for me it feels clunky. 3) No single click edit. On fireb…

[deleted]
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