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The antitrust trial against Google is starting in September

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Re: The antitrust trial against Google is starting in September

#101

Post by lolinder »

constantcrying wrote: post #95
yjftsjthsd-h wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You asked, > Is Microsoft abusing their market position to keep competitors out of the market? and they replied with a list of places MS uses their position to try and push their offerings over competitors.

>You asked No, I did not. I stated the question which would need to be answered if you wanted to figure out if Microsoft should face an anti-trust.

That's not at all how your initial comment reads. You didn't frame the question as a question other people would have to ask, you framed it in a way that clearly invited a response. You might not have liked the way they replied, but your follow-up was super dismissive given that you asked a question.

Re: The antitrust trial against Google is starting in September

#102

Post by bl4ckh0l3 »

siliconc0w wrote: post #54

It's hard to tell if it's Google's dominance causing search to suck or just the web ecosystem naturally optimizing for clicks. I will say most queries with even vaguely commercial intent do seem to get the max or nearly a full page of sponsored links. I don't recall what it was like years ago but I'm pretty sure it is worse. I also think it's pretty clear the platform take-rate needs to be generally lowered across th…

It's hard to tell if any given technology has led to real productivity increases, or just led us to hallucinate productivity increases given the number of little tasks we can fire off with technology. This has been studied; there's too many variables to say "email increased profits 500%!"

If it's too complicated to say one technology is where all the value lie, it's going to be extremely complicated to say Google's existence is meaningful.

We can lean on the fundamental social truism; it's a front to act as a bloom filter for the US dollar, and busy work for people that might otherwise topple the government.

Re: The antitrust trial against Google is starting in September

#103

Post by yjftsjthsd-h »

constantcrying wrote: post #95
yjftsjthsd-h wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You asked, > Is Microsoft abusing their market position to keep competitors out of the market? and they replied with a list of places MS uses their position to try and push their offerings over competitors.

>You asked No, I did not. I stated the question which would need to be answered if you wanted to figure out if Microsoft should face an anti-trust.

Okay, then they provided a list of reasons why the answer is yes.

Re: The antitrust trial against Google is starting in September

#104

Post by layer8 »

concordDance wrote: post #47

Won't this kill Firefox if Google gets told it cant pay browsers to put it as default? That would suck.

My impression is that the actually useful work on Firefox would only require a tiny fraction of the money that Mozilla currently receives from Google.

Re: The antitrust trial against Google is starting in September

#105

Post by bl4ckh0l3 »

constantcrying wrote: post #58
gmerc wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

laughs in constant bing, onedrive, fucking edge, teams upsells on my paid version of windows. Laughs in edge ignoring browser preferences screwing over firefox laughs in constantly returning widgets, Microsoft reward currency on the start menu, forced telemetry. Laughs in teams bundling. Laughs in the coming super monopoly of cross domain AI finetuning in teams. Lol, by the standards of the last century, they are wor…

[flagged]

[dead]

Re: The antitrust trial against Google is starting in September

#106

Post by bogwog »

charcircuit wrote: post #5

>Google has maintained this monopoly, the government alleges, not by making a better product, but by locking down everywhere that consumers might be able to find a different search engine option, and making sure they only see Google. Google improves search every year. Internally they have data to back this up. Google doesn't lock down everywhere consumers can learn about a new browser. The most notable being the defa…

> Better technology does not necessarily mean that you will have the better business.

Right, sometimes an existing company can spend you out of business even if your product is superior, even if consumers prefer your product, and even if your business is more efficient. That's what happens when there's a monopolist in your market: innovation is futile, consumers lose, the monopolist wins. The end.

Re: The antitrust trial against Google is starting in September

#107

Post by constantcrying »

lolinder wrote: post #101
constantcrying wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>You asked No, I did not. I stated the question which would need to be answered if you wanted to figure out if Microsoft should face an anti-trust.

That's not at all how your initial comment reads. You didn't frame the question as a question other people would have to ask, you framed it in a way that clearly invited a response. You might not have liked the way they replied, but your follow-up was super dismissive given that you asked a question.

Thanks for letting me know

Re: The antitrust trial against Google is starting in September

#108

Post by hoppyhoppy2 »

blain wrote: post #63
throwawaysleep wrote: post #4

It is all the other search engines that are crap. Plenty exist, they just suck.

I switched a while ago to DDG and about a year ago to Startpage and both are good enough. It was sure hard to get used to because of presumption that Google has better results but after a while you don't care anymore and find what you're looking for anyway.

Startpage uses Google search results.

>Startpage delivers Google search results via our proprietary personal data protection technology.

(source: https://www.startpage.com/en/ )

Re: The antitrust trial against Google is starting in September

#109

Post by constantcrying »

yjftsjthsd-h wrote: post #103
constantcrying wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>You asked No, I did not. I stated the question which would need to be answered if you wanted to figure out if Microsoft should face an anti-trust.

Okay, then they provided a list of reasons why the answer is yes.

Okay, then I asked him why he did that.

Re: The antitrust trial against Google is starting in September

#110

Post by mikepurvis »

hgs3 wrote: post #96

Antitrust laws are too reactive. We need proactive laws that break up companies if they grow beyond a certain size criteria. Ideally, the criteria would be aggressive enough to kill large corporations leaving behind only small to medium-sized businesses. The result would be markets with increased competition, more innovation, lower prices, more options for employment and self-employment, and the elimination of Big Co…

Is there a model anywhere for this having been tried, successfully or otherwise?

The obvious hesitation I have is just that some companies really do benefit from a lot of vertical integration. Could Apple be Apple if they were forced to spin off the phone business, or the chip design house, or the OS?

What would it mean for the startup ecosystem if getting bought by a conglomerate was a less plausible exit?

How would regulators enforce that the split off entities were truly independent vs faking it and then having exclusivity deals that meant they were basically still the same singular entity?

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