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Zoom terms now allow training AI on user content with no opt out

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Re: Zoom terms now allow training AI on user content with no opt out

#191

Post by jonas21 »

_ddzr wrote: post #11

Thankfully nothing like this is in Jitsi Meet’s TOS: https://jitsi.org/meet-jit-si-terms-of-service/ It never ceases to amaze me how companies choose the worst software!

Section 4 of the Jitsi Meet ToS grants them similar rights. It's just with mushier language.

> You give 8×8 (and those we work with) a worldwide license to use, host, store, reproduce, modify, create derivative works..., communicate, publish, publicly perform, publicly display, and distribute such content solely for the limited purpose of operating and enabling the Service to work as intended for You and for no other purposes.

IANAL, but it seems like that would include training on your data as long as the model was used as part of their service.

Everyone who operates a video conferencing service will have some sort of clause like this in their ToS. Zoom is being more explicit, which is generally a good thing. If Jitsi wanted to be equally explicit, they could add something clarifying that this does not include training AI models.

Re: Zoom terms now allow training AI on user content with no opt out

#192

Post by intrasight »

albert_e wrote: post #63

At the scale of Zoom and MS Teams ... you could theoretically train an AI model that can autonomously conduct all meetings businesses ever need -- all day every day -- without any human ever needing to attend. So much productivity claimed back! GenAI provides the agenda, GenAI bots log in with a AI avatar and spout hallucinations, bots agree to disagree and setup a followup meeting next week after resolving fake cale…

So at the beginning of a Zoom meeting, we'll have to apply a Turning test to all the participants. That'll work at least for a few more years.

Re: Zoom terms now allow training AI on user content with no opt out

#193

Post by tikkun »

gumby wrote: post #189
realusername wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Skype became really really terrible, it looks like it's been unmaintained during the past 10 years, I'd rate its usability worse than most open-source software. The sound quality is also awful, it feels like I'm calling a landline.

Where do you live? In the US at least, landline (AKA POTS) is still the gold standard for audio quality.

Not parent commenter, though facetime audio or telegram audio is my preferred for audio quality.

Re: Zoom terms now allow training AI on user content with no opt out

#194

Post by serial_dev »

I miss the good old days when "if you are not paying for the product, you are the product" meant I need to watch some ads on a free website.

Now, even if you pay for the product, you're still the product, and every company will try to get you to train their AI.

Re: Zoom terms now allow training AI on user content with no opt out

#195

Post by angled »

kortex wrote: post #117
jsnell wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it is saying that your customer content may be used for training AI, in 10.4: > 10.4 Customer License Grant. You agree to grant and hereby grant Zoom a perpetual, worldwide, non-exclusive, royalty-free, sublicensable, and transferable license and all other rights required or necessary to redistribute, publish, import, access, use, store, transmit, review, disclose, preserve, extract, modify, reproduce, share, use…

> You agree to grant and hereby grant I get that legalese is like human-interpretable pseudocode, but like, is there really no better way to word this? How can you grant without agreeing to grant? > import, access, use, store, transmit, review, disclose, preserve, extract, modify, reproduce, share, use, display, copy, distribute, translate, transcribe, create derivative works Wow this cover of Daft Punk - Technologic…

To whom at Zoom do we send the eDiscovery (and litigation hold) requests? My goodness.

Re: Zoom terms now allow training AI on user content with no opt out

#196

Post by j45 »

donalhunt wrote: post #86
ebiester wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does Jitsi handle 500-person+ conference calls these days? This is the killer zoom feature - it looks like Jitsi can handle up to 500 now. https://jaas.8x8.vc/#/comparison . That's personally not enough for many remote companies. So if we're going to have to have Zoom on our machines anyway (to handle an all-company meeting), why not just use it for the rest?

Are 500-person conference calls actually productive? Surely the number of speakers in any such meeting will be a small percentage of listeners?

For real, theres no 500 person conference calls, just mostly a one way broadcast with a stream of questions.

Re: Zoom terms now allow training AI on user content with no opt out

#197

Post by mistrial9 »

ebiester wrote: post #60
_ddzr wrote: post #11

Thankfully nothing like this is in Jitsi Meet’s TOS: https://jitsi.org/meet-jit-si-terms-of-service/ It never ceases to amaze me how companies choose the worst software!

How does Jitsi handle 500-person+ conference calls these days? This is the killer zoom feature - it looks like Jitsi can handle up to 500 now. https://jaas.8x8.vc/#/comparison . That's personally not enough for many remote companies. So if we're going to have to have Zoom on our machines anyway (to handle an all-company meeting), why not just use it for the rest?

> 500-person+

that is called broadcast media -- it was actually better thirty years ago than it is now. If you want conversation then you make a panel, and have a single microphone for the rest.

Re: Zoom terms now allow training AI on user content with no opt out

#198

Post by j45 »

_ddzr wrote: post #11

Thankfully nothing like this is in Jitsi Meet’s TOS: https://jitsi.org/meet-jit-si-terms-of-service/ It never ceases to amaze me how companies choose the worst software!

Jitsi is at least reasonably self hostable, minus the inability to have users to login without some effort.

Re: Zoom terms now allow training AI on user content with no opt out

#199

Post by [deleted] »

ta1243 wrote: post #58
lotsofpulp wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Once you have enough budget for full time lawyers, legal minefields are just another thing to test. Many times, the mines will be inactive, at least long enough to earn money. Better to ask for forgiveness than permission, etc.

My company has been asked to sign a form 899, which seems to be interpreted as meaning we have to ensure that our entire supply chain does not use Huawei I'm not sure how we can do that. For example the only ISP we can use in one of our offices provides internet via a devices with a Huawei MAC address. Now fine, I can see it's part, we could close the office, but how can I confirm that a security contractor we have i…

[deleted]

Re: Zoom terms now allow training AI on user content with no opt out

#200

Post by jimmaswell »

Maybe this can be our magic bullet to save free content after we killed ads: train AI on user input/behavior (at least for a brief period of time until the EU throws another fit and California follows suit). Perfectly fair tradeoff to me - it should be fair use for AI to train on anything at all in my view, same as it's fair use for a human to look at something and learn abstract lessons from it.
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