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Tell HN: I think I found Toyota's battery

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41–50 of 211 posts

Re: Tell HN: I think I found Toyota's battery

#41

> it could release highly toxic hydrogen sulfide gas. How bad is it in real world conditions? Because from what I'm reading it's not the "it makes you sick" kind of toxic, but rather the "it kills you in seconds" kind of toxic.

Current lead acid batteries can do this as well. Smells awful and pretty unsafe situation. H2S is quite dangerous but it’s rare that they’d create an IDLH situation as long as there’s a bit of breeze.

Re: Tell HN: I think I found Toyota's battery

#42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Out of curiosity, What is the wh/kg for petrol?

Wikipedia says 13000 Wh/kg, but you have to keep in mind that due to physics, wear considerations, and emissions regulation, most cars are only 20-40% efficient. At a 20% efficiency, that's 2600 Wh/kg. This is further constrained by gear ratios, meaning not all power is available at all times.

Exactly. Gasoline is much, much more energy dense than Li-Ion batteries, but in terms of dollars per mile, an electric car is 2x-4x cheaper to drive than an ICE car. That's because an internal combustion engine wastes the majority of gasoline's energy as heat, while electric motors use most of the battery's energy to move the car.

Re: Tell HN: I think I found Toyota's battery

#43

> it could release highly toxic hydrogen sulfide gas. How bad is it in real world conditions? Because from what I'm reading it's not the "it makes you sick" kind of toxic, but rather the "it kills you in seconds" kind of toxic.

Rotten eggs smell is just about everything you can get from this kind of experiment.

Now if they scale it up. but at any scale that makes sense economically you can get suffocated by just about any gas you can think of. Like helium or hydrogen.

Re: Tell HN: I think I found Toyota's battery

#44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it could only reduce the weight of current EVs that would be a win. Most electric vehicles weight 1000 lbs or more than their ICE counterparts, and in the extreme case of the Hummer, the total weight is over 9000 lbs. Vehicles seem to be continuously ballooning in size, so whether that continues or eventual legislation forces more reasonable sizes, higher energy density would be very welcome.

When will this meme die? A Model 3 is very comparable in weight to an Audi S3. The Hyundai Ionic 5 is comparable weight and interior volume to a Toyota Rav 4. The Hummer is a monster either way and is not a good sample.

Maybe the S3 can afford to add more insulation compared to the Model 3? I mean Teslas aren't known for good road noise isolation so if they do reduce battery weight they can add some more for the insulation for example.

Re: Tell HN: I think I found Toyota's battery

#45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it could only reduce the weight of current EVs that would be a win. Most electric vehicles weight 1000 lbs or more than their ICE counterparts, and in the extreme case of the Hummer, the total weight is over 9000 lbs. Vehicles seem to be continuously ballooning in size, so whether that continues or eventual legislation forces more reasonable sizes, higher energy density would be very welcome.

When will this meme die? A Model 3 is very comparable in weight to an Audi S3. The Hyundai Ionic 5 is comparable weight and interior volume to a Toyota Rav 4. The Hummer is a monster either way and is not a good sample.

Are there any EVs with Honda Civic or Accord or BMW 2 series weight? E.g. <3500lb? Even a Leaf seems to start at 3500lbs now.

Re: Tell HN: I think I found Toyota's battery

#46
post #14

This will be neat if it works but really there isn't going to be a huge market for 500+ mile cars vs the cost savings of getting a 300-400 mile car. The exception might be road-trippers and people who do a lot of towing but I suspect that is a much smaller population than people tend to think.

Americans don't buy cars anymore, though; not really. They buy ludicrous gigantic heavy pickups and SUVs. So what we're really talking about is getting decent range into oversized pickups that their owners want to accelerate like sports cars and still have a nice air-conditioned interior even when it's 150 degrees on the pavement due to climate change.

You can thank the EPA for that. The gov mandates that vehicles achieve a certain calculated efficiency, or there’s an extra fee/fine attached to the vehicle. Reasonable enough, right?

Unfortunately the way this is calculated is absolutely fucking retarded. Basically, the larger the wheelbase of vehicle, the lower fuel efficiency the vehicle can get away with.

This is why these fucking things keep ballooning in size, have a dogshit turning radius, and are causing an epidemic of frontovers and backover accidents killing or injuring thousands of children every year because there’s no up close visibility.

Video explanation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azI3nqrHEXM

Old small trucks can actually command a premium because of this bullshit. Very few people actually like these huge stupid boats, but there’s just nothing else to buy when you need an actual work vehicle.

Please consider contacting your legislators and putting this on their radar, and keeping it there.

Re: Tell HN: I think I found Toyota's battery

#47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it could only reduce the weight of current EVs that would be a win. Most electric vehicles weight 1000 lbs or more than their ICE counterparts, and in the extreme case of the Hummer, the total weight is over 9000 lbs. Vehicles seem to be continuously ballooning in size, so whether that continues or eventual legislation forces more reasonable sizes, higher energy density would be very welcome.

When will this meme die? A Model 3 is very comparable in weight to an Audi S3. The Hyundai Ionic 5 is comparable weight and interior volume to a Toyota Rav 4. The Hummer is a monster either way and is not a good sample.

I feel like that's quite a stretch of the word comparable.

The Model 3 is 14% heavier than the Audi: https://www.edmunds.com/car-comparisons/?veh1=401999985&veh2...

And the Ioniq5 is 35% heavier than the RAV4: https://www.edmunds.com/car-comparisons/?veh1=401958795&veh2...

Re: Tell HN: I think I found Toyota's battery

#48

This will be neat if it works but really there isn't going to be a huge market for 500+ mile cars vs the cost savings of getting a 300-400 mile car. The exception might be road-trippers and people who do a lot of towing but I suspect that is a much smaller population than people tend to think.

500+ miles means I can just charge up on the weekend and not be bothered with it during the week. I'd pay for that convenience.

Re: Tell HN: I think I found Toyota's battery

#49

This will be neat if it works but really there isn't going to be a huge market for 500+ mile cars vs the cost savings of getting a 300-400 mile car. The exception might be road-trippers and people who do a lot of towing but I suspect that is a much smaller population than people tend to think.

Given an innovation of this sort, there is not a single area of application, extending the range of electric cars. You could also make lighter weight electric cars. Which would have their merits.

Think of the whole spectrum of EVs, lighter weight e-bikes, scooters, skateboards, or long range e-bikes. Electric aircraft start to become feasible.

Much more flight time out of your toy drone, multi-day battery life for your phone or laptop.

Energy storage in off grid setups becomes simpler, or more capacity in the same space.

Etc. etc.

All that provided this new design could function as a more or less slot in replacement, or better, for current lithium batteries in terms of manufacturing, cost, and what not.

Re: Tell HN: I think I found Toyota's battery

#50

This will be neat if it works but really there isn't going to be a huge market for 500+ mile cars vs the cost savings of getting a 300-400 mile car. The exception might be road-trippers and people who do a lot of towing but I suspect that is a much smaller population than people tend to think.

The additional capacity might be wanted in cold climates. The massive range drop when running the cabin heater plus slow charging in cold environments definitely makes me pause when considering an EV.
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