Cue the "You wouldn't download a car" memes.
https://youtu.be/52KR_eC8UFE
I wonder which schools had the children watch this after the pledge of allegiance.
Hackers manage to unlock Tesla software-locked features
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Re: Hackers manage to unlock Tesla software-locked features
#42I'm torn. On one hand, I absolutely think that a capability available in the vehicle/device when you purchased it should be available for you to use, and not behind a software lock (heated seats, etc). On the other hand, an "upgrade" or 100% new software delivered via OTA (self driving, etc) seems a little more like it should be a separate thing.
This analogy/mental model of what things are when you purchase them breaks down for software. It’s less environmentally wasteful to build a single sku and unlock paid software features requiring teams of devs.
> paid software features requiring teams of devs.
This makes it easy for me to make up my mind about. FSD is about far more than just the hardware - there's many teams of devs working on it.
> heated seats
There's little (no?) justification for software locking heated seats. Press the button, make the seats hot. This is just capitalist bullshit and we shouldn't put up with it.
Re: Hackers manage to unlock Tesla software-locked features
#43I'm torn. On one hand, I absolutely think that a capability available in the vehicle/device when you purchased it should be available for you to use, and not behind a software lock (heated seats, etc). On the other hand, an "upgrade" or 100% new software delivered via OTA (self driving, etc) seems a little more like it should be a separate thing.
I'm somewhat torn too. IBM and I'm sure others have shipped enterprise hardware for years that was partially locked. You might get a machine with 16 cpus but you only paid for 8, for example, but you could license the rest as you grew. It seems a little similar and it was in no way underhanded, everyone knew what the deal was. However I'll echo what another poster said. I say Tesla should be free to sell whatever the…
> I say Tesla should be free to sell whatever they want, but if the end user finds a way around it too bad.
The same should go for DVDs, BluRays and streaming media and yet here we are looking at jail time for bypassing the DRM.
Re: Hackers manage to unlock Tesla software-locked features
#44[flagged]
Re: Hackers manage to unlock Tesla software-locked features
#45I'm torn. On one hand, I absolutely think that a capability available in the vehicle/device when you purchased it should be available for you to use, and not behind a software lock (heated seats, etc). On the other hand, an "upgrade" or 100% new software delivered via OTA (self driving, etc) seems a little more like it should be a separate thing.
I'm not torn at all. It's my car. I should be able to "hack" it as long as it doesn't involve illegal access to anyone's servers.
Re: Hackers manage to unlock Tesla software-locked features
#46Good. People who buy things should own the things they buy.
Okay great, but now the lowest cost of the car is an extra $10k because the manufacturing just got a lot more complicated as a result of not being able to build every car the same way.
They can't even build two cars the same way everytime, I think we'll be okay.
Re: Hackers manage to unlock Tesla software-locked features
#47Pretty sophisticated attack vector: low voltage attack on AMD secure execution environment during boot. I wonder how many tries you need to get whatever bits you need in the right place. Also, I imagine you only need to cut 12V wires to do this, but I admire the willingness to get in there direct on these systems. I'd be a little nervous to make those cuts personally.
Buried in the article is the claim that this will let them pull the RSA private key the car owns out for other uses -- while this is likely to remain a very niche attack vector, that's got to be really bad news for someone in vehicle security at Tesla. On the other hand, post jailbreak you could anonymize your location on Tesla's servers, which would be nice.
Re: Hackers manage to unlock Tesla software-locked features
#48They haven't managed to "unlock" the features yet. They've got root on the IC which "could" lead to unlocking them.[1]
https://www.blackhat.com/us-23/briefings/schedule/index.html...
Re: Hackers manage to unlock Tesla software-locked features
#49Good. People who buy things should own the things they buy.
Okay great, but now the lowest cost of the car is an extra $10k because the manufacturing just got a lot more complicated as a result of not being able to build every car the same way.
Then customers have the choice to purchase a vehicle from a manufacturer with more scruples who is willing to sell those features without charging to "unlock" them.
Re: Hackers manage to unlock Tesla software-locked features
#50I'm torn. On one hand, I absolutely think that a capability available in the vehicle/device when you purchased it should be available for you to use, and not behind a software lock (heated seats, etc). On the other hand, an "upgrade" or 100% new software delivered via OTA (self driving, etc) seems a little more like it should be a separate thing.
From the perspective of a customer, what is the difference between a heated seat that doesn't work because it doesn't exist, and one that is locked out by software? Assuming the customer isn't paying up front for that feature. Some people don't want to pay for heated seats. Turns out the manufacturer found it cheaper to just include the hardware anyway rather than differentiate on the production line. What's the big…
The wasted economy on lugging around the extra weight for a useless seat heater.