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A list of recent hostile moves by Google's Chrome team

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Re: A list of recent hostile moves by Google's Chrome team

#171

Post by toastal »

progbits wrote: post #134
dvtkrlbs wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean it was always viable. Chrome did an opt-in experiment that no one heard of and than used it as a justification for ceasing its development. As a format it is just a win-win situation. Most of the companies that deals with images spoke for JXL. I think Google tried to push its own format in favour of JXL. So I really don't think it is moot.

JPEGXL was (co)authored by Googlers so it's also their "own" format.

Google is big enough to have its own bureaucracy & infighting for this to easily & plausibly happen.

Re: A list of recent hostile moves by Google's Chrome team

#172

Post by Macha »

Const-me wrote: post #114
mrtksn wrote: post #57

Remember the "Safari is the new IE" narrative? Just because Safari doesn't support some API doesn't make it IE, IE wasn't an inferior browser at the beginning either. What made IE the IE everyone hates was its departure from standards(?) and enforcing its own vision of the web thanks to its enormous market share. On IE's case, MS probably stagnated it to prevent competition against its desktop Apps business and on Go…

> departure from standards There were no new HTML standards between 4.0.1 in 2000, and 5.0 in 2014. > enforcing its own vision of the web thanks to its enormous market share Modern web is only possible because Microsoft implemented non-standard XMLHttpRequest in IE5. However, they didn’t do that to enforce a vision. The goal was practical — save network bandwidth for their Outlook Web Access product.

ES5, 2009, CSS 2.1, 2011. HTML is not the only standard for a web browser

Also in that period, Microsoft was failing to comply with the standards for CSS 2, standardised in 1998, ES3, standardised in 1999, and PNG, standardised in 1996.

Re: A list of recent hostile moves by Google's Chrome team

#173

Post by toastal »

viscousviolin wrote: post #123
hutzlibu wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Do you mind if I ask what you use those for?" Game engine. "As for the tracking - I'm pretty sure Firefox blocks a lot of those by default, last time I checked it was plastered all across their homepage" And the thing is, that firefox itself is tracking you and sends that data home. Maybe look up what "studies" mean. But so far at least you can opt out of it, unlike with chrome.

Ah, I see what you mean. I'm personally not against this at all, since the Firefox devs need feedback on what's working and what isn't. But I completely understand that some people won't accept this. Only thing I can't figure out is if this is opt-out or opt-in, because I might have mindlessly clicked yes on opting in during installation.

If you want the opt-out version of Fx, there’s LibreWolf & Mullvad.

Re: A list of recent hostile moves by Google's Chrome team

#174

Post by toastal »

amelius wrote: post #16

Webmasters should really fight back and show annoying popups when the user agent equals Chrome. These popups could nudge the user towards e g. Firefox. Perhaps EFF.org could provide a reference implementation of such popups.

I added one last month already :)

Re: A list of recent hostile moves by Google's Chrome team

#175

Post by kmlx »

dbish wrote: post #3

The problem is there are almost 0 alternatives beyond Firefox so if you don’t like their UX you’re stuck. All the “new” browsers are just chromium skins (edge, arc, etc.) Are there any real competitors building a new browser?

i’ve been a happy safari user (desktop and mobile) for years now.

Re: A list of recent hostile moves by Google's Chrome team

#176

Post by pbhjpbhj »

tommiegannert wrote: post #64
mrtksn wrote: post #57

Remember the "Safari is the new IE" narrative? Just because Safari doesn't support some API doesn't make it IE, IE wasn't an inferior browser at the beginning either. What made IE the IE everyone hates was its departure from standards(?) and enforcing its own vision of the web thanks to its enormous market share. On IE's case, MS probably stagnated it to prevent competition against its desktop Apps business and on Go…

IE was absolutely hated for not evolving. I'm curious what "its own vision" was, other than "do as little as possible, while Mozilla and Opera keeps pushing forward." Now, this is from the perspective of the web developer. I don't think IE was ever hated the same way from the end-user perspective. Chrome is still innovating, but now end-users hate it, because it's trying to be too much. The "new IE" hat still belongs…

Perhaps the issue here is age? At the start IE was cutting edge, then MS didn't do anything useful with it for 10 years. Filters were certainly part of its own vision, AIR.

MS seemed to innovate most in breaking hacks that helped to work around their "quirks".

Re: A list of recent hostile moves by Google's Chrome team

#177

Post by kmlx »

rhn_mk1 wrote: post #143
bawolff wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

HN is weirdly obsessed with jpeg-xl. The logic for removing it totally made sense.

There's nothing weird about the obsession. It's the most technically impresive format so far.

avif? webp?

Re: A list of recent hostile moves by Google's Chrome team

#178

Post by kmlx »

asaddhamani wrote: post #13
colordrops wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aa long as chromium is open source and various entities are able to build and remove/modify anti-user features, i don't see a problem with alternatives being a "skin". If Google makes moves to make it difficult to modify chromium then browser maintainers will quickly migrate to other engines.

What other engines?

webkit

Re: A list of recent hostile moves by Google's Chrome team

#179

Post by ksey3 »

progbits wrote: post #148
taopai wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is my main browser in android. Never seen any add except some new stuff hard-coded. Yes there is something about crypto but I never used it. I am a pretty happy user. I don't understand why they market their product, I don't know any other alternative that blocks adds and is that fast on android. Users concerned about security and privacy should use TOR. It is very useful to browse websites blocked in my country.

"there is crypto but I don't use it" Fair enough, but some of us consider the mere presence of crypto features to be a problem. It entirely erodes my trust in the teams judgment and if Firefox ever added something like that would have to switch away as well.

Just dismissing it as a "crypto feature" is pure robotic mindlessness. We are past the point where crypto scammers ruled the day. The scammers/hype herd have moved on to AI.

Who is left behind holding the crypto bag, are different kind of people. Even central banks are using "crypto features" to implement CBDCs. The BAT tokens Brave has proposed is not a bad thing, even if it doesn't work out, to the problem of Attention Capture and Attention theft. We need such ideas and experiments. People's attention is not someone else's property. Google and Mozilla don't even talk about how much Attention theft is going on, leave alone what the solution is.

Re: A list of recent hostile moves by Google's Chrome team

#180

Post by helloooooooo »

tommiegannert wrote: post #64
mrtksn wrote: post #57

Remember the "Safari is the new IE" narrative? Just because Safari doesn't support some API doesn't make it IE, IE wasn't an inferior browser at the beginning either. What made IE the IE everyone hates was its departure from standards(?) and enforcing its own vision of the web thanks to its enormous market share. On IE's case, MS probably stagnated it to prevent competition against its desktop Apps business and on Go…

IE was absolutely hated for not evolving. I'm curious what "its own vision" was, other than "do as little as possible, while Mozilla and Opera keeps pushing forward." Now, this is from the perspective of the web developer. I don't think IE was ever hated the same way from the end-user perspective. Chrome is still innovating, but now end-users hate it, because it's trying to be too much. The "new IE" hat still belongs…

Do end users hate Chrome? Or is this just the perspective bias of the crowds that frequent HN?

It still has a broad market share, and even Chromium forks are not making a dent. They are evidently doing something right.

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