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Splitting the Web

ploum.net

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Re: Splitting the Web

#41

Post by masfuerte »

EGreg wrote: post #15

As I’m blocking completely google analytics, every Facebook domain and any analytics I can, I’m also disappearing for them. I don’t see them and they don’t see me! Aww how cute. No, they can still track what you do. Remember Facebook Beacon and the outcry? It is now a reality. Facebook (oh excuse me, Meta) doesn’t back down after people vehemently react to Newsfeed, Beacon, Metaverse etc. Mark used to respond “Calm d…

Beacon was client side. If you block access to facebook domains then they receive nothing.

Re: Splitting the Web

#42

Post by EGreg »

masfuerte wrote: post #41
EGreg wrote: post #15

As I’m blocking completely google analytics, every Facebook domain and any analytics I can, I’m also disappearing for them. I don’t see them and they don’t see me! Aww how cute. No, they can still track what you do. Remember Facebook Beacon and the outcry? It is now a reality. Facebook (oh excuse me, Meta) doesn’t back down after people vehemently react to Newsfeed, Beacon, Metaverse etc. Mark used to respond “Calm d…

Beacon was client side. If you block access to facebook domains then they receive nothing.

If a company has your first name, last name or other information, they can send it to Facebook

Large corporations are buying this data, and even governments

https://www.fastcompany.com/90310803/here-are-the-data-broke...

https://www.propublica.org/article/everything-we-know-about-...

https://www.dli.tech.cornell.edu/post/facebook-and-google-ar...

Re: Splitting the Web

#43

Post by throwing_away »

> When browsing on the "normal web", it is increasingly required to disable at least part of your antifeatures-blockers to access content.

Author lost me here.

I use Firefox and Kiwi browser with uBlock Origin with all the annoyance lists enabled, bypass-paywalls-clean, unpaywall, sponsorblock, alternate player for twitch, violentmonkey and a few scripts. I also have yt-dlp, streamlink, and mpv.

I regularly read HN, Slashdot, and TechMeme, and it's extremely rare to get a link that I can't access.

Oftentimes I can access content without a browser, thanks to mpv's excellent web support.

I get that it's annoying, but it's really not that hard to solve it once and rarely think about it again. This has been my setup for at least 3 years now.

Occasionally something will annoy me and get through my filters, and I have to spend a few minutes fixing it.

The only thing I'm walled off from right now that's slightly annoying is browsing specific accounts in "X" with tweets ordered by timeline and viewing tweet replies. This is really low value so I haven't bothered looking for a solution, but if anyone knows one, feel free to link it here.

Re: Splitting the Web

#44

Post by jfengel »

klabb3 wrote: post #7

It’s the monopolistic companies aka mega corps that really restrict individuals and stifle innovation. In the small-mid sized space, there are shitty actors but they’re easier to avoid, and don’t require resorting to living in a cave. They are competing with each other in the traditional sense of the word. They’re not on a mission to extinguish. This is not unique to tech, it’s everywhere. Private actors that become…

In what way do they stifle people? I had the impression that for the most part they just ignored small fry. If you want to boot up a server and point a DNS address at it, knock yourself out.

You can't "innovate" on Facebook's site, but why would you want to? People go there to do Facebook things. Your own web site is limited primarily by your imagination. (And occasionally the law, but that requires some pretty extreme stuff.)

Re: Splitting the Web

#45

Post by teekert »

I feel this too. Moreover, I often want to signup fro something, like a webshop. Often it simply does not work and I choose to order without an account, sometimes it works then. Sometimes I need to disable ublock, sometimes I need to use Edge (on Linux). Often I'm already dropping out, using a different shop altogether.

I guess we are a group to small to care about though.

Re: Splitting the Web

#46

Post by masfuerte »

superkuh wrote: post #19

>People who try alternative networks such as Mastodon or, God forbid, Gemini. People who poke fun at the modern web by building true HTML and JavaScript-less pages. Mastodon is actually part of the "HTTP as a secure application delivery protocol" and is no longer part of the "HTTP as website document delivery" team. To me that seems the biggest split: self contained application versus hyperlinked documents.

It's such a shame. I stopped reading twitter links when they went js only. Mastodon is actually worse because there's no way I'm enabling js from some random domain I've never heard of before. It would take literally a couple of hours to add an unstyled html feed but, apart from me, who wants that?

Re: Splitting the Web

#47

Post by skydhash »

8chanAnon wrote: post #2

From the article: But, increasingly, I feel less and less like an outsider. It’s not me. It’s people living for and by advertising who are the outsiders. They are the one destroying everything they touch, including the planet. They are the sick psychos and I don’t want them in my life anymore. My thoughts exactly. Like the author, I don't have patience for glossy websites anymore. If a site needs third-party JS to be…

I’m moving to Firefox as my main browser, and the amount of sites that break because of me blocking JavaScript (with ublock) is staggering. I can understand SPA being JS only, but simple blogs and other content sites, no.

Re: Splitting the Web

#48

Post by jakelazaroff »

Kovah wrote: post #31
jakelazaroff wrote: post #3

> It feels like everyone is now choosing its side. You can’t stay in the middle anymore. You are either dedicating all your CPU cycles to run JavaScript tracking you or walking away from the big monopolies. You are either being paid to build huge advertising billboards on top of yet another framework or you are handcrafting HTML. Is that happening? I feel like there's a ton of middle ground, and it's only ever expand…

I thought that there must be a middle ground after reading that part, too. But we, the people who know, run and support that cozy web, are actually a minority compared to the mass of internet users. It's not a good comparison, but my family and friends know absolutely nothing about all the things that make up the cozy web. Dozens of people and literally nobody knows what RSS, Mastodon or blogs are. When asked about p…

I don’t think I understand what you’re getting at. Like, yeah, the “cozy web” is fairly marginal, but the “tech-savvy” web the article discusses is even more so.

Re: Splitting the Web

#49

Post by GMoromisato »

It's not symmetric, however. Those of us on the "full web" are still able to access everything. Which is why I don't feel compelled to "pick a side".

Still, I do feel the enshittification that they're talking about. I hate that Google is less reliable and that (e.g.,) reading a recipe online requires shoveling away a mountain of spam. I think this is just the natural consequence of funding the web through ad clicks.

Shameless plug: I'm working on something called GridWhale, which I hope eventually turns into a modern, global BBS. We'll be able to afford to publish the info you want without ads because we're getting revenue elsewhere. But since the revenue will come from customers, our incentives will be aligned, and we won't need to sacrifice privacy or use dark patterns.

OK, I realize I'm not adding much to this discussion, but I was just waiting for the compiler. Sorry.

Re: Splitting the Web

#50

Post by reboot81 »

I reject the ad injected sites, most gets handled with Pihole. To much ads? ⌘ + w. FB? I open the app once every 3 weeks, cant stand the ads. As the OP wrote: I have enough to read anyway.
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