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Worldcoin: A solution in search of its problem

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Re: Worldcoin: A solution in search of its problem

#71

Post by remcob »

lolinder wrote: post #9

> While Worldcoin may have developed an algorithm that reliably distinguishes unique irises among its test pool, it’s not clear that it will work with a pool orders of magnitude larger. This is a really key problem. The main application of biometrics today is in cell phones, and for those we operate on the assumption that we're trying to distinguish between the authorized user and a quite small pool of non-authorized…

This is essentially the Birthday paradox. You need a quadratically better false match rate to deduplicate than to authenticate. It’s also why Worldcoin went with Irises (highest entropy among biometrics), custom hardware, custom optics and an in-house trained algorithm.

Re: Worldcoin: A solution in search of its problem

#72

Post by ttepasse »

hef19898 wrote: post #44
qingcharles wrote: post #21

This image (FTA) is straight out of some insane dystopian nightmare: https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_pr... That the photo represents a real event in real reality is absurd o_O

Some people take cyberpunk as entertainment, some as a paraody, some as a warning, some as all of the above. And some take it as blue print worth pursueing. EDIT: The while premise of needing a nin-centralized wax of confirming ones identity is, at its core, deeply un-demicratic. As of bow, government issued documentation confirms anyones identiy. These governments can be democratic, and are. Puting a different syste…

@AlexBlechman on TwiX had this tweet some years ago:

Sci-Fi Author: In my book I invented the Torment Nexus as a cautionary tale

Tech Company: At long last, we have created the Torment Nexus from classic sci-fi novel Don't Create The Torment Nexus

Re: Worldcoin: A solution in search of its problem

#73

Post by panarky »

qingcharles wrote: post #21

This image (FTA) is straight out of some insane dystopian nightmare: https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_pr... That the photo represents a real event in real reality is absurd o_O

If you think thousands of people voluntarily getting iris scans that aren't stored anywhere is an insane dystopian nightmare, wait until you hear about the 1.3 billion people who were compelled to surrender their biometrics to the centralized, government-operated Aadhaar system.

Re: Worldcoin: A solution in search of its problem

#75

Post by tarruda »

_9omd wrote: post #63

Remember, Sam Altman is the guy who made open AI into closed AI, and he’s the cofounder of this. If you think he has any intent of making this an open decentralized system that benefits people you’re likely mistaken.

I would not trust someone who claims they are working on a project that benefits people.

I would be less suspicious of someone working on a selfish project that might benefit people as a side effect.

Re: Worldcoin: A solution in search of its problem

#76

Post by smaudet »

kibwen wrote: post #49
HenryBemis wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a tip/gift/bonus/incentive for people to give away their data. And since this is a game of numbers, they knew that throwing $10-20-30 USD to about 400mn people in poor countries they would get the momentum going. I expect Europeans to shun this. I fear though that once they hit "1bn people" they will invoke the FOMO into the rest.

> I fear though that once they hit "1bn people" they will invoke the FOMO into the rest. Over a billion humans have intestinal parasites, but that doesn't mean people are queuing up for worm eggs.

Perhaps not, but that's what marketing is for...

"Increase your resistance gut to parasites with our revolutionary cure!"

Or some such...

And then you realize what complete sleezy snakes most of these tech bros are.

Re: Worldcoin: A solution in search of its problem

#77

Post by sirreal14 »

hef19898 wrote: post #44
qingcharles wrote: post #21

This image (FTA) is straight out of some insane dystopian nightmare: https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_pr... That the photo represents a real event in real reality is absurd o_O

Some people take cyberpunk as entertainment, some as a paraody, some as a warning, some as all of the above. And some take it as blue print worth pursueing. EDIT: The while premise of needing a nin-centralized wax of confirming ones identity is, at its core, deeply un-demicratic. As of bow, government issued documentation confirms anyones identiy. These governments can be democratic, and are. Puting a different syste…

> The while premise of needing a nin-centralized wax of confirming ones identity is, at its core, deeply un-demicratic. As of bow, government issued documentation confirms anyones identiy. These governments can be democratic, and are. Puting a different system in place, controlled by some tech-billionaire-liberitarian, is as dytopian as it gets.

I deeply hate this line of logic. This exact argument was presented against the Signal messaging app in an Op-Ed in the NYT (https://archive.is/tJoem), to quote from it:

> They are a small group of people who govern these powerful tools, and they are not accountable in the way that, say, a democratically elected government is. Whether law enforcement should tap our phones on the condition that a warrant is obtained is, at the very least, worthy of public discussion. Signal has unilaterally decided for us all.

Boo hoo, math makes it so that governments (yes, even democratic ones) can't tap phones, therefore math (and the technologists who code up this math) are evil and anti-democratic.

For all WorldCoin's faults, merely attempting to offer a decentralized alternative (even if it's not a very good one!) to government proof-of-person solutions is not one of them.

Re: Worldcoin: A solution in search of its problem

#78

Post by panarky »

_9omd wrote: post #67
SkyMarshal wrote: post #30

Lots of good analysis here, with the main flaw (imho) coming in last*. The WC team may be book smart, but not experienced or wise, especially in building complex systems with high integrity and assurance. They cut too many corners, take too many intellectual shortcuts, assume away too many hard problems, minimize important constraints inherent in their chosen architecture, and clearly haven't really thought it all th…

I can’t imagine how naive you have to be to not see account selling as a massive problem. Especially when your plan is to first onboard users in poor countries. Why would these people do anything other than signup and immediately sell their accounts, for what may amount to a month or two of normal pay, just for waiting in line and getting scanned. I find it crazy that they claimed their system is Sybil resistant when…

> sweet sweet VC money

Sure, yeah, maybe that's all it is, a scam that's totally transparent and obvious to every random internet commenter but totally non-obvious to the simple and gullible marks on Sand Hill Road.

Or maybe, just possibly, there might be more to it.

Perhaps it takes a little more effort to understand than just piling on to the reflexive groupthink cynicism which passes for conventional wisdom around here.

(Disclaimer: I have no association with this project, haven't gotten my irises scanned, don't own the token, haven't invested any effort to understand it. But I've been around long enough to recognize the smell of reflexive groupthink cynicism, and to profit by betting against it.)

Re: Worldcoin: A solution in search of its problem

#79

Post by TechBro8615 »

_9omd wrote: post #58
qingcharles wrote: post #21

This image (FTA) is straight out of some insane dystopian nightmare: https://substackcdn.com/image/fetch/f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_pr... That the photo represents a real event in real reality is absurd o_O

And these people don’t give two shits about world coin, they just want the free money the company is throwing at them. This things is doomed to fail, because the biometrics are only authenticated when you setup your account initially like in this photo. So these people can collect the sign up fee and the then turn around and sell their account to a someone else, thereby nullifying the sybil resistance of the system.

Interesting how Worldcoin chooses to start in countries where this demand exists, almost by definition the poorest countries in the world, where the infrastructure is not only barely needed, but also most likely to be abused by the same governments that created the poverty in the first place.

Re: Worldcoin: A solution in search of its problem

#80

Post by gcatalfamo »

I am going to be downvoted to death, but it is clear from last year events that Sam Altman is truly that kind of "Blade Runner/Robocop(1)"-like antagonist character that has a narcissistic drive to destroy the world just so he can show everybody he is saving it.

(1) Pick your 80's Sci-Fi movie dystopia that fits here.

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