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How the Rich Reap Huge Tax Breaks From Private Nonprofits

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Re: How the Rich Reap Huge Tax Breaks From Private Nonprofits

#171

Post by PrimeMcFly »

s1artibartfast wrote: post #166
PrimeMcFly wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know. Any answer I give would be worthless and based on feeling. It's a question for economists to answer. And there are good answers and things worth following, or at least trying, instead of letting tax rates be set by feeling which they largely are now.

What would an economist be trying to optimize?

My point is simply like a lot of other things, government financial policy should be set based on science and understanding, not by politicians in power who feel they know best.

Re: How the Rich Reap Huge Tax Breaks From Private Nonprofits

#172

Post by s1artibartfast »

twoodfin wrote: post #155
s1artibartfast wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The story is pretty different if you include state and local taxes. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/37/Fe...

As in we’re taxing way more!

Especially if you consider GDP (adjusted for inflation) has grown over time as we..

If you compare to a benchmark like the 1940s, tax% of GDP has more than doubled, and GDP has increased ~4x. This means someone today is paying about 10X the taxes (controlling for for inflation!)

Re: How the Rich Reap Huge Tax Breaks From Private Nonprofits

#173

Post by rapnie »

brigadier132 wrote: post #43
dools wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The bigger problem is a fear of public spending because of perceived incompetence. The stigma comes from a time when only governments had run big bureaucratic systems. Now we can see there is little difference between public and private bureaucracies except for a lack of oversight on the latter. Still the stigma remains and all public spending is filtered through a profit making entity.

Can you actually give examples of competent public spending? The military is considered one of the competent parts of the US government and the amount of waste is staggering. On any given night 4000 people are sleeping on San Francisco's streets and the government can't solve that with a $636 million a year budget? The US spends more per student than any other nation and somehow we have worse educational outcomes?

> Can you actually give examples of competent public spending?

You have to weigh that against the negative effects of profit maximisation of commercial entities for the consumer. To what extent is "Can I get away with making this product/service shittier and increase profit margins?" cause of a life getting more expensive and difficult for the average person? Take healthcare. It is getting more expensive with an aging population needing more care. But also large chunks of the healthcare supply chain become ever more commercial, with companies exploiting their cozy niche for every penny.

Re: How the Rich Reap Huge Tax Breaks From Private Nonprofits

#174

Post by s1artibartfast »

PrimeMcFly wrote: post #171
s1artibartfast wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What would an economist be trying to optimize?

My point is simply like a lot of other things, government financial policy should be set based on science and understanding, not by politicians in power who feel they know best.

at the end of the day, it is ultimately a subjective question.

Science and understanding cant decide what you want and how much of it, it can only help you decide how to get what you want.

Re: How the Rich Reap Huge Tax Breaks From Private Nonprofits

#175

Post by KennyBlanken »

tommiegannert wrote: post #65
dools wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The bigger problem is a fear of public spending because of perceived incompetence. The stigma comes from a time when only governments had run big bureaucratic systems. Now we can see there is little difference between public and private bureaucracies except for a lack of oversight on the latter. Still the stigma remains and all public spending is filtered through a profit making entity.

The big difference is that I can choose not to pay a company I don't like, and that's fine. Governments will happily make my life crap if I don't pay taxes. I dislike greed as much as the next person, but the monopolized incarceration powers of governments are not to be forgotten. For some services, collective funding makes sense, like having hospitals that can stop the spread of diseases, or forcing pooling of money…

[flagged]

Re: How the Rich Reap Huge Tax Breaks From Private Nonprofits

#176

Post by boeingUH60 »

jmyeet wrote: post #24

Private foundations are really a massive scam on the public purse so whenever you hear about the Gates Foundation and the like, remember it's just a tax dodge, nothing more. The way the rules work, a private foundation has to spend 5% of its capital on its intended purpose. Thing is, that 5% can include "administration" costs like paying salaries and benefits for the family. They really need to raise this to 10%, min…

The Gates foundation example makes no sense and frankly reeks of ignorance. The foundation has given out over $70 billion in grants since inception [1]…money that came primarily out of Gates’s pockets.

In what way does losing $70 billion imply a tax dodge because he avoided paying $10B to $20B in taxes had he kept that money for himself? You know, he could have simply paid the taxes and kept the remaining $50 billion in in his pockets.

Re: How the Rich Reap Huge Tax Breaks From Private Nonprofits

#177

Post by Eisenstein »

sokoloff wrote: post #165
JKCalhoun wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why take your property taxes to educate our nation's children when you don't even have children? Am I unfairly framing your argument? Society (that's us) want things for society and it turns out they cost money. We would love to pay for these things with razor-like efficiency but we live in an imperfect world. (The "waste" however still goes into someone's wallet and can be in turn spent at a local restaurant or on g…

> (The "waste" however still goes into someone's wallet and can be in turn spent at a local restaurant or on groceries.) It could equally well be spent by me if left in my wallet rather than taxed away and wasted.

Sure, but what about the billionaires. When they get a huge tax break do they go down to the local diner and give the waitress a $1,000,000 tip? Probably not -- they invest it into making more money -- consolidating more wealth for themselves.

Re: How the Rich Reap Huge Tax Breaks From Private Nonprofits

#178

Post by PrimeMcFly »

s1artibartfast wrote: post #174
PrimeMcFly wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My point is simply like a lot of other things, government financial policy should be set based on science and understanding, not by politicians in power who feel they know best.

at the end of the day, it is ultimately a subjective question. Science and understanding cant decide what you want and how much of it, it can only help you decide how to get what you want.

> at the end of the day, it is ultimately a subjective question.

Disagree. It's the realm of philosophy at the end of the day, but that doesn't mean it is subjective. We have very good, very fleshed out reasoned arguments about what would be best for most people.

If it is agreed that there are universal human rights and country specific rights, which is something already agreed upon by society; as is the goal of ensuring rights be equally enforced for each person, that they be respected as they should be - just starting from that is a pretty solid base that would result in real changes and is already consistent with societies desires.

Re: How the Rich Reap Huge Tax Breaks From Private Nonprofits

#179

Post by dantheman »

JKCalhoun wrote: post #100
zo1 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's all marketing at the end of the day. But tbf, after a decade of a many public sector projects, I have first-hand seen really incompetent and wasteful actions on huge scales. Perhaps there should he a whistle blower program for reporting such things?

> incompetent and wasteful actions on huge scales As others have pointed out, this is independent of whether we're talking about the government or private sector. Regardless, when I see workers on a road crew standing around I don't think "wasted tax dollars", I think "money going back into the economy." Of course in my view of a fair society it would be a preponderance of idle, wealthy money that is going back into…

There is a fundamental difference between public and private and that is one of consent. We have no consent when it comes to government actions.

Look at the amount of money wasted on the the war on drugs.

Where do you think wealthy money is if not in the economy?

Re: How the Rich Reap Huge Tax Breaks From Private Nonprofits

#180

Post by the-rc »

mycologos wrote: post #29

I know, I know, "bounties" are a fraught concept. Some people find "snitching" odious. But this is a tantalizing use case. All the author of this piece got out of their legwork was another article, but it also yielded some money for the federal government: > Two days after I emailed Finwall in April inquiring about the Xie Foundation’s purchase of the house, the foundation filed records with the California attorney g…

Isn't that what Form 211 does? You can get up to 30% of what the IRS collects.

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/f/form-211.asp

"In 2021, it was reported that 645 claims were submitted, resulting in 179 awards for a total of $36 million on an additional $245 million collected. In 2020, there were 593 claims and 169 awards for a total of $86.6 million paid out on $472 million in additional collections."

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