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If we want a shift to walking we need to prioritize dignity

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Re: If we want a shift to walking we need to prioritize dignity

#451

Post by ClumsyPilot »

cscurmudgeon wrote: post #279
bichiliad wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can find a ton of much worse examples than the US, but the US is just vastly far behind Europe (i.e. Spain, to which OP was comparing the US to). Plus, it's worth mentioning that while Tokyo has a lot of mixed-traffic streets, the streets are small, have very low speed limits, and have strong restrictions on the size and type of car that can actually be within the city. It's less like you're walking in traffic an…

Unpopular opinion: We (US) should stop subsidizing Europe's security while they are better than us and can afford to do so. https://cvafoundation.org/does-the-us-subsidize-european-def...

US is defending its interests in Europe, not Europe itself. This benefits GoldmanSacks, rather than it is for the benefit of Nathan the Romanian plumber.

Europe is the largest affluent market outside US. They’ve considered purchasing tech from China, they’considered taxing internet tech companies based on revenue instead of profit, and each time US convinced them not to.

Re: If we want a shift to walking we need to prioritize dignity

#452

Post by Zak »

ytdytvhxgydvhh wrote: post #286
degrews wrote: post #106

I moved from Spain to the US, and I often find myself trying to explain to people back home just how miserable and even humiliating the pedestrian experience is here. Here are some other examples of things that I think contribute to the hostile walking experience in the US: * Cars parked in short driveways often extend all the way across the sidewalk. Even if you can easily step off onto the road to walk around them…

Tinted windows are such a pet peeve of mine. I get it in the tropics but in most of America the individual benefits of dark tint seem like they’d be outweighed by the collective good of better visibility through cars, enabling eye contact with drivers, etc. The SUV craze is really to blame - in general many US states don’t allow dark tint on traditional cars but do on SUVs. And since rear windows on vans and light tr…

SUVs having different rules is bizarre, but I'm confused as to how this impairs your ability to make eye contact with drivers since it doesn't apply to the front windows.

Re: If we want a shift to walking we need to prioritize dignity

#453

Post by ClumsyPilot »

croisillon wrote: post #203
whimsicalism wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Even a lot of the anti-cycling stance comes down to, “What am I, poor?” When you are using transportation infrastructure that’s designed with contempt for you, you know, and you don’t want to be there. I grew up in close contact with a large urban poor population and I think the view of bikes was the exact opposite of this. Biking in the city is considered the purview of affluent white people

in my local facebook bike-to-work group i often comment about Schrödinger's cyclist: "too poor to have a car" according to some haters, and at the same time "too rich to be in a hurry" (because motorists have a real job they're driving to) according to others

Ye I am really getting whiplash from these contradictions

Re: If we want a shift to walking we need to prioritize dignity

#454

Post by Aeolun »

IG_Semmelweiss wrote: post #184
degrews wrote: post #106

I moved from Spain to the US, and I often find myself trying to explain to people back home just how miserable and even humiliating the pedestrian experience is here. Here are some other examples of things that I think contribute to the hostile walking experience in the US: * Cars parked in short driveways often extend all the way across the sidewalk. Even if you can easily step off onto the road to walk around them…

really? Tokyo is very oriented towards pedestrian traffic, considering shinkansen and most rail service - yet satellite suburban sites, like Saitama, etc have tiny residential rows that literally don't fit both a car and a pedestrian. And that's where most people live. Yet Japan is highly pedestrian. Now, South America. Most if not all urban centers of 1M are extremely well covered by bus networks. And they have to,…

> Yet Japan is highly pedestrian.

Japan’s cars are mostly small, civilized and without tinted windows.

Sidewalks next to large roads generally have a barrier that clearly separates the bike/pedestrian traffic from the cars.

If there’s roads where there is no separation between cars and pedestrians the speed for the cars is generally limited to 30km/h.

Streets also have natural speedbumps in the form of lantern and electricity poles essentially standing on the street, instead of the sidewalk.

I certainly feel safer walking here than anywhere in the US.

Re: If we want a shift to walking we need to prioritize dignity

#455

Post by Kuinox »

xyzelement wrote: post #450
Kuinox wrote: post #448

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did not missed it, but you describing it as a walkable city was funny. I don't have kids, but you also watched 0 video of the person I sent. They do have kids. Also, lots of inhabitants of Paris, Amsterdam have kids, yet a lot simply don't have a car.

Sure. I grew up in eastern Europe and most people didn't have a car - because they couldn't afford it. The few lucky ones that had one used it all the time. I can totally imagine having a kid in NYC or Paris or whatever without a car it's just a pain in the ass.

An appartement in Paris for a family is at least a millions dollar, you are telling me they can't afford a car? No, moving in car is simply inconvenient here. You can walk or take the public transit to get where you want, it's just faster. Lots of parisians have a car, often in a parking spot far from their home, and rarely uses it. Someone commuting to Paris with a car instead of public transit is seen as someone mad loosing their time in bad transit. Again, watch the videos of the person I sent, you prone bringing a new point of view while it's the same carbrain arguments that is unable to even imagine an alternative, that already exists.

Re: If we want a shift to walking we need to prioritize dignity

#456

Post by brightlancer »

thebradbain wrote: post #393
brightlancer wrote: post #373

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I guess the stigma that only poor people (And we Mexicans are poor you know haha) take the bus is pretty alive in some parts of the US. Because it's mostly true. It's not _always_ true and we shouldn't hold prejudices, but it would be just as wrong (though not as un-PC) to claim that public transit was used equally across income levels, racial/ ethnic checkboxes, etc. "Americans who are lower-income, black or Hispa…

The funny thing is that a lot of the “crime, drug use, and general anti-social behavior” on transit is overblown in the very minds of people who don’t take transit regularly. Sure, in the US it’s nowhere near as pleasant as it could (or should) be, but it’s really not that bad, nor as slow as people with a car imagine it is. My realtor said I was the only person she’s worked with who has ever bought a house that does…

> The funny thing is that a lot of the “crime, drug use, and general anti-social behavior” on transit is overblown in the very minds of people who don’t take transit regularly.

Yes, it's unheard of that folks can become accustomed to circumstances which most people would view as abnormal or dangerous.

I've been riding public transit almost my entire life; I started riding _by myself_ when I was 8 so I could get to and from school, back when the Bronx was much more violent.

Riding during rush hour is a very different experience than riding off-hours. While I almost never felt unsafe (gotta keep your head on a swivel), lots of women have told me how they've regularly felt unsafe. Maybe it's some dude ranting on a subway car. Maybe it's one ranting on the subway platform. Maybe it's a dude sitting WAY too close on an empty bus. Then there's the open drug use on some systems like BART.

> but it’s really not that bad,

Maybe you're just more tolerant of crime, drug use and general anti-social behavior.

Re: If we want a shift to walking we need to prioritize dignity

#457

Post by Aeolun »

inferiorhuman wrote: post #366
degrews wrote: post #106

I moved from Spain to the US, and I often find myself trying to explain to people back home just how miserable and even humiliating the pedestrian experience is here. Here are some other examples of things that I think contribute to the hostile walking experience in the US: * Cars parked in short driveways often extend all the way across the sidewalk. Even if you can easily step off onto the road to walk around them…

just how miserable and even humiliating the pedestrian experience is here I ended up talking to some woman yesterday who mentioned she loved to come back to Oakland because of how walkable it is compared where she is now in the central valley. I was amused at the whole exchange because while Oakland and San Francisco do a decent job, they're by no means great. Cars parked in short driveways often extend all the way a…

Damn, that’s some damning contrast. The city looks so much better without all the cars.

Re: If we want a shift to walking we need to prioritize dignity

#458

Post by chrismcb »

degrews wrote: post #106

I moved from Spain to the US, and I often find myself trying to explain to people back home just how miserable and even humiliating the pedestrian experience is here. Here are some other examples of things that I think contribute to the hostile walking experience in the US: * Cars parked in short driveways often extend all the way across the sidewalk. Even if you can easily step off onto the road to walk around them…

It is illegal in most places to park a car on the sidewalk. I don't know of anyone, at least the big chains, that will serve a pedestrian in a drive thru. If you live in a more walkable part of town there is usually an all night diner.

Re: If we want a shift to walking we need to prioritize dignity

#459

Post by sobkas »

sndknd wrote: post #382
vivalasvega wrote: post #368

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps, then, those officers could get safer jobs doing something else, if they are unable to perform their duties. Or perhaps it could be harder to drive around freely with and conceal a deadly weapon. We have a lot of options other than "just let people break the law, I guess".

Nope. “Let people break the law” is the new standard.

> Nope. “Let people break the law” is the new standard.

First of all cops in America don't have to do nothing. Being robbed or murdered? Nah, let's look other way. Mass shooter on the prowl? But he can shoot at me better hide. White person in expensive car, nothing happened, nothing to see. But as soon there is money to be made through civil forfeiture, every cop is all of sudden a brave law defender. There is no money in law enforcement, but a lot in legalised theft.

Re: If we want a shift to walking we need to prioritize dignity

#460

Post by makeitdouble »

sershe wrote: post #396
tvaughan wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I often find myself trying to explain to people back home just how miserable and even humiliating the pedestrian experience is here. Same. I’ve lived in Los Ángeles and Amsterdam, and it is impossible to explain to my friends and family just how awful the quality of life is in LA precisely because of the difference in attitudes and priorities over cars. Perhaps some have “nicer” (aka bigger) houses in LA than they…

Subjectively worse, not objectively worse. I think driving is much more convenient and nice for most things I like to do. The only exceptions I can think of are if I were a kid in a car-centric area (strangely, the thinking in the US is usually reversed, kids supposedly need to be in the burbs), or if I was drunk. I don't often get drunk, so I'd prefer to drive for everything from minor groceries to outdoor activitie…

A thought exercice: would you enjoy living in a 3x bigger house and drive a small cart from room to room ? with a well adapted house it could be more convenient. Would it be nicer ?
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