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Former intel officer says 'non-human biologics’ found at alleged UFO crash sites

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Former intel officer says 'non-human biologics’ found at alleged UFO crash sites

#641

Post by rdtsc »

StrictDabbler wrote: post #639
rdtsc wrote: post #530

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since the earth, and the whole solar system, along with the galaxy are moving through space, I can imagine some clever scientist discovering time travel, firing up they time machine, only to then find themselves in vacuum of space in a place the earth had long passed by already. Others try to calculate and predict the position. But they didn’t use enough floating point precision bits and ended up in the earth’s crust…

There's an Isaac Asimov story from the 50's that I wonder if you've read. It's called "Blank!" In the story the scientist takes a friend forward 22 hours, but outside the time machine door there's nothing. Total darkness. The friend asks if the scientist forgot the movement of the Earth and the galaxy, but the scientist assures him that no, that motion has been accounted for. Instead it appears they've arrived betwee…

Thanks for the suggestion, I was not aware of "Blank!".

What inspired me to write the comment is was thinking about time travel and how people in movies and stories seems to always materialize on a nice level surface, somewhere in a building with the their feet exactly on the floor, in a nice meadow outside the city, on a sidewalk etc. Then, remembering how earth and galaxy move through space I thought how extremely hard would be to get a safe set of future spacetime coordinates to land on.

Re: Former intel officer says 'non-human biologics’ found at alleged UFO crash sites

#642

Post by mikeyouse »

behringer wrote: post #424
mikeyouse wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Willing to get arrested would be a huge signal that he's an actual whistleblower and not full of shit! There's almost no chance he'd face any consequences given the topic and the amount of support he'd have the from the public, and even then, Daniel Hale's sentence for disclosing dozens of classified documents to reporters was ~3.5yrs in jail. The LARPers pretending like he'd be sent to gitmo are completely in lala l…

If a top secret UFO program exists and even the president doesn't know about it, then a place like gitmo is exactly where you can expect to go.

So the President doesn't know about it, but this random FBI dork does -- and it's such a well-kept secret that we're willing to extrajudicially imprison Americans who reveal details about the program -- but only if they do so in open testimony and not in a SCIF?

And he'll go to Gitmo, but only if the details are specific, because the people who will extrajudicially imprison the whistleblower for revealing details of the program are following the laws we have about classification?

Yeah...

Re: Former intel officer says 'non-human biologics’ found at alleged UFO crash sites

#643

Post by krapp »

zikzak wrote: post #640
tsimionescu wrote: post #629

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First of all, the Alcubierre drive only works if several things that have never been confirmed to exist do in fact exist. Secondly, even if it turns out that exotic matter and such exist somewhere in the universe, the Alcubierre drive only works in their presence. So, it can't be used to travel FTL to a place where they don't exist, such as the Earth.

When von Neumann probes were proposed, we did not have working AI or 3D printers. They were merely concepts with some proof of concept systems in various states. We now have those technologies. It is trivial to extrapolate how effective they will be in say 10,000 years if we avoid blowing ourselves up. By then maybe we'll even have a sustainable Fusion reactor, general AI, and atomic matter deposition. Do you accept…

Obviously Von Neumann probes haven't blanketed the galaxy as if they had, it would be obvious. Not to belabor a point I made in another comment, but the Fermi Paradox is a harsh taskmaster.

So this leaves a few possibilities:

1) No intelligent, technologically advanced civilization exists in the universe other than ourselves, because any such civilization would have developed Von Neumann probes, which would mean the galaxy should be covered by them.

2) No intelligent, technologically advanced civilization has yet developed Von Neumann probes.

3) Von Neumann probes exist, but they haven't blanketed the galaxy. Since the math says it should be easy for them to do so, either they were developed relatively recently and simply haven't had the chance to do so, or else confounding factors exist which make the process of unbounded exponential growth more difficult than the math would suggest.

None of these possibilities lead to the conclusion that UFOs (assuming the narrative presented by Grusch and other UFO believers) as described are more likely to be Von Neumann probes than not.

Any nearby civilization that released millions of self-replicating probes should be noticeable. We've studied nearby stars, there's no evidence of any of the telltale signs of energy usage or heat that should accompany something on that scale.

Also, there's no evidence of replication on the part of these objects within the UFO narrative. What are they feeding on? Where? Exponential replication means if they're here they should have stripped our solar system clean by now. Why haven't they?

All of the behavior described resembles conventional, piloted craft rather than the expected behavior of swarms of Von Neumann probes.

Re: Former intel officer says 'non-human biologics’ found at alleged UFO crash sites

#644

Post by zikzak »

krapp wrote: post #643
zikzak wrote: post #640

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When von Neumann probes were proposed, we did not have working AI or 3D printers. They were merely concepts with some proof of concept systems in various states. We now have those technologies. It is trivial to extrapolate how effective they will be in say 10,000 years if we avoid blowing ourselves up. By then maybe we'll even have a sustainable Fusion reactor, general AI, and atomic matter deposition. Do you accept…

Obviously Von Neumann probes haven't blanketed the galaxy as if they had, it would be obvious. Not to belabor a point I made in another comment, but the Fermi Paradox is a harsh taskmaster. So this leaves a few possibilities: 1) No intelligent, technologically advanced civilization exists in the universe other than ourselves, because any such civilization would have developed Von Neumann probes, which would mean the…

So you are unwilling to consider what we have these people reporting are those probes?

Without evidence, that's a really reasonable position that I can respect.

Edit - I wanted to point out that the probes need not strip the system of resources. They might exist to observe, document, and relay data.

Thank you for your response.

Re: Former intel officer says 'non-human biologics’ found at alleged UFO crash sites

#645

Post by thumbuddy »

edgyquant wrote: post #372
thumbuddy wrote: post #326

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stuff like this always hits the news when really bad shit is either going down or about to go down as a distraction.

No it doesn’t. I don’t know, or particularly care, either way but this statement is something insufferable people throw around to seem smarter than everyone else. Military people don’t testify before congress about UFOs “everytime something big is about to happen” and people aren’t as stupid as you think that they can only care about one issue at once.

I'm not trying to sound smart but this has been going on since like the 80s...

Re: Former intel officer says 'non-human biologics’ found at alleged UFO crash sites

#647

Post by nradov »

dontlaugh wrote: post #638
chiefalchemist wrote: post #637

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can split hairs all you want about the ruling class and the gov but the latter is the sock puppet of the former. That is, they are effectively one in the same. When that duo screws the proles - and it does, often - that IS good for China. aka Communist China. Balloon = "new red scare" = "we need more DoD budget" = "we don't have money for X, Y, and Z" = "let them eat balloons" It's a tired and known pattern. But…

I'm a communist, I don't need convincing. The bourgeoisie in the US is the ruling class because they have state power. They use that power to exploit the proletariat of the US, but also to super-exploit the proletariat of the rest of the world. In China, it's a bit different. The proletariat has won state power and is using it to constrain their national bourgeoisie. Part of why their bourgeoisie is tolerated for now…

I hope I live to see the day when the people of China rise up and summarily execute every single member of the Communist party down to the lowest village functionary. That would be the best thing they could possibly do to ensure a positive future for their country, and the rest of the world.

Re: Former intel officer says 'non-human biologics’ found at alleged UFO crash sites

#648

Post by operatingthetan »

seamac3 wrote: post #646
operatingthetan wrote: post #624

Earlier quoted context omitted.

farming

farming what?

I don't know, I just have this idea that we aren't actually on the top of the food chain so to speak. Maybe it's farming for genetic diversity. Or maybe you start civilizations to get them to birth bespoke AI personalities, or some other wacky idea.

Re: Former intel officer says 'non-human biologics’ found at alleged UFO crash sites

#649

Post by jtriangle »

tsimionescu wrote: post #631
FollowingTheDao wrote: post #367

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The government is not leaking anything. If you watched and knew about the people who testified today, they are whistleblowers. They are going against the government. And they have been administratively terrorized. That’s their word.

I honestly don't understand how someone can look at David Grusch speaking and come to any other conclusion than that he's crazy or lying. His whole demeanor reminds me of the infamous Tom cruise Scientology interview.

You mean the one where he shook Oprah?

Re: Former intel officer says 'non-human biologics’ found at alleged UFO crash sites

#650

Post by AtlasBarfed »

likeabbas wrote: post #235
montagg wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they aren’t bringing evidence, it’s a waste of people’s time. Taking a big risk that is most likely a very bad decision shouldn’t provide any credibility at all. Do that when you can show evidence, and then you have credibility.

Grusch gave program names, people involved, and locations of these special access programs purported to be reverse engineering non human technology to the ICIG and both intelligence committees in congress. Call your congressman and ask if he is credible.

So there's been a half century of "reverse engineering", but there is no evidence of aerospace technology leaps in the half-century this has allegedly been going on. Rocket engines, materials engineering, etc, all pretty much have a well laid out public technological evolution, from theory to experimental engineering to productization, distributed across aerospace, materials engineering, etc in thousands of companies and universities and factories.

The technologies alleged would transform human existence, and would mean trillions or more commercially. Effortless exploitation of asteroid resources being the low hanging fruit. Even if it isn't an instantaneous interstellar drive, it would imply freedom from gravity wells and practical inter-system transportation.

And how is it that there is one pilot that sees UAPs on the regular? This is like the UFO abductee that has been abducted a dozen times. If a pilot is seeing regular UAPs, there will be a hundred pilots seeing this phenomena.

Put it to you this way. If we happened to have alien UFOs crashlanding on the planet, it would be of utterly paramount importance that the technological gap represented is closed as soon as possible, for the survival of the species. It would involve every engineer and scientist being read in to get as much reverse engineering probability as possible.

It would mean marshalling worldwide resources for exploitation and development of space resources and defenses.

I actually like the Robotech / Macross take on this, where the alien SDF-1 crashes on the Earth, and a world war is basically halted in shock. A world government is formed, and immediate worldwide financial reasources are poured into reverse engineering and immediate space-based capabilities developed. That is basically what would happen if the world was shocked by the arrival of technologically superior aliens and we got our hands on some of their technology.

As it turns out, the scale of defenses constructed in the ten years after the SDF-1 is a pittance compared to the 4.8 million space cruisers and likely 50+ billion alien soldiers available to the aliens when they arrive.

The only way there would be no usable technological reverse engineering is if the arriving UFOs specifically built landing craft with the technological base of the natives, or somehow the technology is black boxed in some way that it degrades/self-destructs if there is a crash.

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