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Llama and ChatGPT Are Not Open-Source

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Re: Llama and ChatGPT Are Not Open-Source

#21

I personally do not want the companies to release training data (at least for a while) because then it gives people leverage to neuter it. I don't want a sanitized LLM, and I don't have $60M lying around to train my own. Copyrighted material, sexual content, political opinions, throw it all in and release it please! Yes, reducing bias in the models is a noble goal, but introducing new bias and blindspots to do it is…

We really need to somehow separate a bias towards accuracy as distinct from some bias towards say, a sports team. Using everything would be like taking a bunch of students final exams and then claiming the most common answers are the correct ones. This isn't how expertise and accuracy works. Most things worth doing are not only genuinely hard and complicated but something that only a minority subset of accomplished p…

Why is it a binary choice? "Most students would answer X, due to this common misconception about Y".

As we have seen from history, there is not often an absolute truth to questions, only clusters of truths. We want our LLM to be able to perform reasoning, mathematics, and science, but expecting absolute truths in anything outside of those fields is a bit much. Wikipedia often takes a good approach here and strikes this balance well. You can represent the "crazies" and show their reasoning, and then draw attention to how it is commonly refuted. You don't get this if you just omit the "crazies" to begin with.

Edit: What I'm saying is that you can include/represent these adjacent clusters of answers instead of asserting one cluster to be true and allow the correct answer to be represented organically. And guess what? Some people will still disagree for whatever reason they have to disagree. We should be taking all this AI alignment money and putting it into education imo.

Re: Llama and ChatGPT Are Not Open-Source

#22

Can we please stop using terminology related to code for something that's not code?

Agreed it's annoying, but on a certain level also not entirely wrong. In a software 2.0 [0] world the weights are functionally the code in that it is what gets you from input to output.

Open weights or something similar would be better though

[0] https://karpathy.medium.com/software-2-0-a64152b37c35

Re: Llama and ChatGPT Are Not Open-Source

#24

I personally do not want the companies to release training data (at least for a while) because then it gives people leverage to neuter it. I don't want a sanitized LLM, and I don't have $60M lying around to train my own. Copyrighted material, sexual content, political opinions, throw it all in and release it please! Yes, reducing bias in the models is a noble goal, but introducing new bias and blindspots to do it is…

> then it gives people leverage to neuter it

Could you expand on that a bit?

Re: Llama and ChatGPT Are Not Open-Source

#25

I personally do not want the companies to release training data (at least for a while) because then it gives people leverage to neuter it. I don't want a sanitized LLM, and I don't have $60M lying around to train my own. Copyrighted material, sexual content, political opinions, throw it all in and release it please! Yes, reducing bias in the models is a noble goal, but introducing new bias and blindspots to do it is…

Add me to the list. I share your opinion.

Re: Llama and ChatGPT Are Not Open-Source

#26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nah, these are foundation models. Companies want to be able to put in guard rails that are applicable to their application, not start with a model lobotomized according to US tech company values. The censorship is about telling people how to think, like it always is, not for the good of the people using the models.

> US tech company values Which do broadly align with the values across most of the world. But if you want to build something that has different values then go ahead. But you can't expect companies to be complicit in doing something which is unethical or illegal.

> Which do broadly align with the values across most of the world.

Satire?

Re: Llama and ChatGPT Are Not Open-Source

#27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> US tech company values Which do broadly align with the values across most of the world. But if you want to build something that has different values then go ahead. But you can't expect companies to be complicit in doing something which is unethical or illegal.

> Which do broadly align with the values across most of the world. Satire?

Colonialism

Re: Llama and ChatGPT Are Not Open-Source

#28
"Mark Dingemanse, a coauthor of this report, had a particularly strong assessment of the Llama 2 model: "Meta using the term `open source' for this is positively misleading: There is no source to be seen, the training data is entirely undocumented, and beyond the glossy charts the technical documentation is really rather poor. We do not know why Meta is so intent on getting everyone into this model, but the history of this company's choices does not inspire confidence. Users beware.""

Re: Llama and ChatGPT Are Not Open-Source

#30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nah, these are foundation models. Companies want to be able to put in guard rails that are applicable to their application, not start with a model lobotomized according to US tech company values. The censorship is about telling people how to think, like it always is, not for the good of the people using the models.

Yup. Advance the foundation models as far as possible to create a representation of the internet/human experience and place safeguards on top. Don't want your LLM to be used to create erotic fanfiction? Instead of gutting the LLM, just put a detector on the query and answers feeding into the LLM. Thankfully, with a non-neutered model you have access to a tool than can be used to perform such detection...

Or tell another instance of the model to act as a constitutional-driven censor and let them duke it out.
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