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How India Became America

nytimes.com

11–20 of 97 posts

Re: How India Became America

#11
post #3

Before the elites in India consider themselves comparable to America, I would hope they address the swingeing poverty and piss poor literacy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poverty_in_India http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_literacy_r...

Not sure if you're Indian or not. But if you're not, your reply seems mean-spirited and misses the point of the article. And as an American, I want to distance myself from this attitude. Each country has its issues that it is dealing with. It's hardly for the elites on this site to tell the elites in India what to do.

Re: How India Became America

#12
post #2

I could write a bit more, but the summary of what I would say, having lived in India for about 10 years, mostly during my turbulent teens, is: 1. Poverty is not a virtue. 2. There was evil in the old days too

I don't have any specific experience with India but I am also always a little skeptical with attitudes like that in the second half of the article. It seems to just be another instance of 'the good old days' syndrome. Especially the anecdote about violence - surely there were never murders in India before McDonald's moved in.

You are so right. The connection is really weak ... But as for the audacious title - the article begins the analysis in the correct era - the liberalization of the Indian economy. But more than anything, why India became a "half-hearted" America - is:

1. Because it wanted to - We grow up n stiff competition knowing the holy grail is to crack the IIT entrance exam which is really an assurance for your trip to the promised land. The uncle and aunt staying abroad are a constant source of inspiration, who _defined_ "success" and would return home once every 2 or 3 years like war heroes with loots in the form of Lindt, Ghirardelli or board games that had a strange smell of, well, "happiness"!

2. MTV - MTV India was launched sometime when I was in standard 5 or something. Indian youth till then had seen only two channels which where sacred entertainment came in the form of "Mahabharata", "Ramayana", "Krishna", "Chanakya" - all epics or history heroes, mythical heroes - mind it none at the same time - often years apart. "Chitrahar"/"Rangoli" had some hot sauce - songs from our Bollywood movies - which featured middle aged angry young men dancing with a troupe on a massive drum in a forest. And then there was MTV - a breath of fresh air, new GODS, new way of dressing, and a better glimpse of the promised world. This was followed by the explosion of cable tv - HBO, Star movies, Star World - streamed in streets of New York, Chicago directly to our living room, and engraved it in our hearts.

3. Movies - Some argue Bollywood and cricket can change governments in India. Our movies soon caught up with the cable and MTV - and in no time the colleges depicted in movies started looking more like a school in the US (For any Indian reading this - these are Shahrukh Khan & Yash Raj brand of movies). They defined what is cool. Soon there were fake american brands available in every footpath stalls.

4. Broadband - Internet changes everything. Soon we were talking on chatrooms, downloading pirated mp3-s of Pink Floyd, watching more of Hollywood (yeah - sweet p2p baby). Our regular vocabulary has been enriched by the f-word, Kurt Cobain T-shirt was a must have. Even Indi-porn - which primarily featured voluptuous females taking bath had adopted the new tricks of the trade.

5. Final blow - IT, outsource and call center. This is the only part where America had a direct hand - you Bangalored your overpriced jobs and provided the jet pad we needed to take off for the american dream. Easy money => more american brands + worst_of_both_worlds_accent => Cool. With more purchasing power young college graduates _with_ a job in Wipro, TCS, Infosys etc. were looking for places to spend - and this is what led to mushrooming of shopping malls all over the country. So where did the design inspiration for these malls come from? Well, to cater to the needs of the customer oriented the architects looked West ...

That in a nutshell how India is becoming America. Nothing is good or bad, its just the way it changes.

Re: How India Became America

#14
post #3

Before the elites in India consider themselves comparable to America, I would hope they address the swingeing poverty and piss poor literacy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poverty_in_India http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_literacy_r...

Not sure if you're Indian or not. But if you're not, your reply seems mean-spirited and misses the point of the article. And as an American, I want to distance myself from this attitude. Each country has its issues that it is dealing with. It's hardly for the elites on this site to tell the elites in India what to do.

I'm not American. I think it's pretty fair to hold the successful to account for environment in which their success exists.

“A Nation’s Greatness is Measured By How It Treats Its Weakest Members.” Mahatma Gandhi

Re: How India Became America

#15
post #3

Before the elites in India consider themselves comparable to America, I would hope they address the swingeing poverty and piss poor literacy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poverty_in_India http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_literacy_r...

It would be interesting to know what the elites of America would do if it was easy for a poor person to board a flight and land in the US. I guess stop them at the door by not allowing visas.

poverty and human suffering is a burden that must be shared by everyone who is aware of it. Americans owe their prosperity to many historic factors, including a near virgin land and colonising a native population, apart from the American spirit.

Having said there is no doubt Indian elites must do more.

Re: How India Became America

#16
post #3

Before the elites in India consider themselves comparable to America, I would hope they address the swingeing poverty and piss poor literacy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poverty_in_India http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_literacy_r...

These are issues that aren't going to be addressed overnight, no matter Indian elites wishes for or not. These will take years or even decades to be addressed because of the socio-economic differences here and complex to understand cultural issues. There should be steps taken to rapidize the process and main problem which is preventing it in my opinion is the another big elephant in the room - corruption. But in the same time, I'm really happy with whatever progress we've made from 1980s (when i was born) till now. I grew up with it and live between 2 worlds still. But not everyone had the same opportunity I had and definitely it will take decades to address everyone with the huge population we have. Poverty less or fully literate India is most probably not possible in your or my lifetime.

Re: How India Became America

#17
post #3

Before the elites in India consider themselves comparable to America, I would hope they address the swingeing poverty and piss poor literacy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poverty_in_India http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_literacy_r...

Yes, because if there's two things American elites care deeply about, it's literacy and poverty.

Re: How India Became America

#18
post #3

Before the elites in India consider themselves comparable to America, I would hope they address the swingeing poverty and piss poor literacy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poverty_in_India http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_literacy_r...

Not sure if you're Indian or not. But if you're not, your reply seems mean-spirited and misses the point of the article. And as an American, I want to distance myself from this attitude. Each country has its issues that it is dealing with. It's hardly for the elites on this site to tell the elites in India what to do.

I am a first generation American, my family owned a farm in Gujurat, India. I am grateful to have been molded by two cultures that both value Universal Compassion and Scientific Method. Not all members practice it, but the ideals were passed down at least and the future of both nations will depend upon how seriously they practice their founding ideals.

"Be not afraid, for all great power throughout the history of humanity has been with the people. From out of their ranks have come all the greatest geniuses of the world, and history can only repeat itself. Be not afraid of anything. You will do marvelous work." - Swami Vivekananda, a founding father of modern India

Re: How India Became America

#19
Author has a very laser-focused view of India. The country is much more diverse that this article supposes. There is still extreme poverty, religious bigotry, no-holds barred traffic lawlessness, corruption, discreet money and hundreds of other very-Indian issues.

Americanization of India is limited to metros and big cities, and there too you see a mind-boggling mix of poverty and abundance.

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