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Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

reuters.com

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Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#261

Post by purpleidea »

dinom wrote: post #259
malwrar wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I actually got stranded once for some hours because of the mileage indicator! Was driving back from a campsite that I turned out to not have charging compatibility with, but thought I had plenty of margin to get to the nearest charger. As I drove through the mountains however, I began noticing that a.) my battery was depleting much faster than expected and b.) I wasn’t seeing any houses and very few motorists. I watc…

> able to get a tow truck capable of transporting my car (turns out you need one that has a full bed because of the regenerative breaking Sounds incredibly short-sighted that the regenerative braking can't be temporarily disabled by the driver... two people can push a "regular" car to a nearby gas station in a pinch. Even one person can push a smaller car around a parking lot if necessary. That said, they often send…

Tesla cars are way heavier. Nobody is pushing one with their friend. Unless it's downhill.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#262

Post by mwint »

sethd wrote: post #88
wredue wrote: post #70

>Inside the Nevada team’s office, some employees celebrated canceling service appointments by putting their phones on mute and striking a metal xylophone, triggering applause from coworkers who sometimes stood on desks. It’s weird how this sentence was probably supposed to surprise the reader, but I really just reflected on how the fans conduct themselves regularly and thought “yup, sounds about on par”.

Just like a scene out of The Wolf of Wall Street. This company appears to be fraudulent to the very core.

I’ve thought that ever since they got caught rolling an EV down a hill for a promo video, after taking tons of money from a major automaker.

Wait? That wasn’t Tesla? Okay, I guess there’s a level below “fraudulent to the very core”

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#263

Post by berkes »

Dalewyn wrote: post #225
malwrar wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I actually got stranded once for some hours because of the mileage indicator! Was driving back from a campsite that I turned out to not have charging compatibility with, but thought I had plenty of margin to get to the nearest charger. As I drove through the mountains however, I began noticing that a.) my battery was depleting much faster than expected and b.) I wasn’t seeing any houses and very few motorists. I watc…

This really is an extreme and specific example, but risks like this are why most people want lots ( lots ) of range and why gas/diesel cars won't die out any time soon. The sheer ease of mind that comes with having densely packed energy that can be replenished at a moment's notice practically anywhere should not be disregarded easily. Maybe battery tech can get there some day, but it's certainly not today.

Why can't battery tech achieve this?

I have a very old petrol car (>35y) with a terrible fuel-indicator. I bring a spare 5L tank with petrol under the backseat always.

An EV could achieve the same with a small portable powerbank, not?

My current tank can hold some 50+L; this gives my old T3 a range of ~430km¹. When we lived in Botswana ('83, other car) we had an extra 150L spare fuel-tank instead of back-seats. We could do some 1500km in this old 4wd on full tanks. Which was needed as gas-pumps were easily 300km apart and often out of gas.

An EV could achieve the same with the back-seats replaced by additional battery-packs, not? I'd presume this might be too heavy or not allowed due to regulations, but technically just adding ridiculous amounts of batteries would solve this. Like adding ridiculous tanks for gas would.

Sure, the amount of joules you can pack in a KG of fuel is far more than in a KG of batteries. But to me the solution then is easy: just add more KGs.

¹yup, the mileage is terrible, a VW T3 is basically an underpowered, 1500kg brick

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#264

Post by KingOfCoders »

croes wrote: post #256
KingOfCoders wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I hate almost everything about it." Not owning a car only using rentals, I still think Tesla has the best and most intuitive UI. I can find everything easily, whereas in a SUVs from Skoda/VW/Audi/BMW/Renault/... it's hard to find things - at least for me. What I do hate about the Model Ys we rented is the noise! Wind/wheel noise is as loud at 100km/h as a BMW at 150km/h - I guess they do this to safe weight and incr…

>the best and most intuitive UI I think the best UI was before all the computer displays in cars. Everything operable without visual contact.

I disagree. Because we seldom have the same car twice, I always need to decipher some strange icons to find out what something does. Or how to operate the wipers. It might work better if you know it b/c of tactile feedback, but it's in no way intuitive.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#265

Post by vel0city »

ravenstine wrote: post #182
gonehome wrote: post #122

I don’t really get the range complaints at this point, with an ICE vehicle people rarely know their range they just look at a gauge for F to E. With the superchargers, range doesn’t really have a material effect anymore and most of the time the network isn’t necessary anyway. It’s not a real issue.

That's because, even today, gas stations are far more ubiquitous than charging stations. People who own IC cars don't pay that much attention to range because there's rarely a question that they'll find a gas station within their last remaining gallon. With electric, that's a bit of a different story, especially when you're driving a long distance, and to somewhere that's not a major metropolitan city with thousands…

I pay way more attention to the range of my ICE car over my EV, because I need to actually go someplace out of my way to recharge it while my EV practically always has more range than I need every day.

I spend more of my time recharging my ICE than I do my EV. It's way less convenient and I never know what the cost will be tomorrow. Meanwhile my electricity is on a fixed rate contract measured in years.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#266

Post by ComputerGuru »

cowsandmilk wrote: post #93
londons_explore wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Battery meter at the top is EPA range - ie. the official range measurement method, in basically ideal conditions. The routefinder 'learns' from your previous driving habits. Driving style easily has a 50% impact on range between "drives 50 mph slipstreaming behind a truck" and "drives 90 mph and brakes aggressively at every corner".

No reason it has to show the EPA range. My family’s Subaru has “learned” that it lives in the mountains and the range estimates reflect that. And I’m pretty sure it’s a simply looking at what kind of gas mileage it got recently. When we have kayaks on top of the car, it readjusts the mileage estimates down pretty quickly. All these comments about ICE vehicles being the same ignore that when ICE vehicles have estimate…

Same with my VW.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#267

Post by swader999 »

aaronblohowiak wrote: post #235
swader999 wrote: post #190

I rode ebikes for commuting about 15 years ago. Looking at electric cars, I need at least double whatever specs they state for max range. So if I need 400 miles for instance, I need to find a manufacture promising 800. Wind, cold, age of battery, emergency reserve etc all play into it.

You drive 400miles without access to charging?

No, I was using experience with ebikes to explain that battery specs need to be halved for useful range consideration. For car I need about 400 miles range to replace my has car, so 800 advertised would work for me.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#268

Post by throwaw1yyy »

dkarl wrote: post #144
ke88y wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that reputation already died in the last 2-3 years. It's now pretty common in my circle to hear people say they'll pay a premium to not own a Tesla. Primarily because of lots of bad experiences with build quality/repairs, but also because there are now lots of high quality alternatives. Namely Rivian and Lucid, but also the legacy automakers (two friends bought mach-es recently and there's a smattering of F-1…

Musk is pretty much the whole reason. People have a much easier time remembering sleazy business practices when there's a celebrity CEO whose personality matches the crime. If you think about the CEOs of major corporations, the only ones who are personally memorable for the public are founders. How many exceptions can you think of, memorable personalities that were hired as CEOs or rose to become CEO of established c…

[flagged]

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#269

Post by rsynnott »

wredue wrote: post #87
ke88y wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that reputation already died in the last 2-3 years. It's now pretty common in my circle to hear people say they'll pay a premium to not own a Tesla. Primarily because of lots of bad experiences with build quality/repairs, but also because there are now lots of high quality alternatives. Namely Rivian and Lucid, but also the legacy automakers (two friends bought mach-es recently and there's a smattering of F-1…

Our caravan has been a pile of shit, which I’m sure anyone who’s ever had a caravan can attest to. Anyway. We are looking for reliability and imagine my surprise when Kia, of all brands, came out king of generally affordable reliability. Plus their EV reviews reasonably well. A lot has changed in 10 years for vehicles I guess…

Kia's more or less just Hyundai, these days, isn't it? Like, a Kia Nero (electric version) is much the same thing as a Hyundai Kona.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress thousands of driving range complaints

#270

Post by matthewdgreen »

wil421 wrote: post #42
PhilipA wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had a Tesla Model 3 which was very optimistic with the range. My BMW iX3 however is quite conservative and I can usually drive longer than the display states.

We don’t have the iX3 in the US (yet?). I was looking at the x5 plug in hybrid with ~40 miles electric range and the normal b58 straight 6 motor. My wife has the X7, we have 3 kids and hobbies so I’m not sure if even an i5 would work. The new X5 headlights are not my favorite. Do you like the BMW electric system?

The X5 hybrid is a wonderful car to drive, but as an EV it's... not good. You get less than 1/10th the range of a full Tesla Model Y (The BMW also includes a tiny 16A charger, whereas the old i3 had a 32A charger. This limits charging to ~3 range-miles per hour, making public chargers basically pointless (again compare to the LR Tesla Model Y which has a 48A charger and can add 40+ range-miles in an hour.) In gas-only hybrid mode, the mileage is ~19 MPG, which is actually kind of offensive for a hybrid car.
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