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Google vs. the Open Web

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Re: Google vs. the Open Web

#61

Post by surajrmal »

Daril wrote: post #41

This is a clear sign of Google's weakness. They are losing their monopoly and are desperately trying to hold on to the net. In the last few weeks, they have announced that they will try to block navigation if you have an ad blocker installed (for example, when watching a video on Youtube). Take a look at Fuchsia for another example ... they are losing the control on Android, so they started this new project ... it is…

> Take a look at Fuchsia for another example ... they are losing the control on Android, so they started this new project

I work on fuchsia and can honestly say I have no idea what you're talking about. Fuchsia and android are more complimentary than they are competitive. I've noticed that when there is a lack of information, people tend to invent things that fit their narrative, but that's a really dangerous habit.

Re: Google vs. the Open Web

#62

Post by tiltowait »

hotstickyballs wrote: post #4
sakex wrote: post #3

Soon, websites will require kernel access to make sure you don't have cheats installed. (Sarcasm, obviously)

Not that extreme but some banking apps on android did check for root at some point and refused to run so there may be precedent

It might be more common than you think. Some major SAST tools complain if you aren't checking if the device is rooted, and it wouldn't surprise me if some naive shops blindly followed the recommendation without need.

Re: Google vs. the Open Web

#63

Post by xNeil »

Larrikin wrote: post #47
cataphract wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Doing their job by losing everything in court like the Activision/Microsoft case just last week? Great use of government resources.

I'd rather they bring cases and lose some instead of never bringing cases and letting the corporations do whatever they want with no fear of consequences.

If they bring cases and lose them corporations will continue doing whatever they want since there will be no consequences. It's important for the FTC to know what fights are worth fighting, and they will be taken seriously.

Re: Google vs. the Open Web

#64

Post by lambic »

ajross wrote: post #7
troupo wrote: post #2

The link to Yoav Weiss's blog is great. --- start quote --- So, you don't like a web platform proposal ...you may feel that your insights and experience can be valuable to help steer the platform from making what you're sure is a huge mistake. That's great!! Getting involved in web platform discussions is essential to ensure it's built for and by everyone. ... In cases where controversial browser proposals (or lack o…

Clearly the implication is that rushing to join a professional discussion just to yell about some or another controversial proposal you read about on HN is not going to work to sway the stakeholders. If you want influence, you need to cultivate it over time by building trust in the community you want to influence. That's hardly controversial. In particular, taking a fairly dry proposal like WEI, which is intended as…

Your definition of shitposting is... odd.

Re: Google vs. the Open Web

#65

Post by Dah00n »

Daril wrote: post #41

This is a clear sign of Google's weakness. They are losing their monopoly and are desperately trying to hold on to the net. In the last few weeks, they have announced that they will try to block navigation if you have an ad blocker installed (for example, when watching a video on Youtube). Take a look at Fuchsia for another example ... they are losing the control on Android, so they started this new project ... it is…

If you are this paranoid about someone showing ads or collecting your information, maybe Brave isn't the best choice, with their history of getting caught with both hands in the cookie jar. Especially since you already use Firefox elsewhere. Mozilla also collects information btw.

Re: Google vs. the Open Web

#66

Post by Daril »

surajrmal wrote: post #61
Daril wrote: post #41

This is a clear sign of Google's weakness. They are losing their monopoly and are desperately trying to hold on to the net. In the last few weeks, they have announced that they will try to block navigation if you have an ad blocker installed (for example, when watching a video on Youtube). Take a look at Fuchsia for another example ... they are losing the control on Android, so they started this new project ... it is…

> Take a look at Fuchsia for another example ... they are losing the control on Android, so they started this new project I work on fuchsia and can honestly say I have no idea what you're talking about. Fuchsia and android are more complimentary than they are competitive. I've noticed that when there is a lack of information, people tend to invent things that fit their narrative, but that's a really dangerous habit.

Taken from Wikipedia : Fuchsia is an open-source capability-based operating system developed by Google. In contrast to Google's Linux-based operating systems such as ChromeOS and Android, Fuchsia is based on a custom kernel named Zircon. It publicly debuted as a self-hosted git repository in August 2016 without any official corporate announcement. After years of development, its official product launch was on the first-generation Google Nest Hub, replacing its original Linux-based Cast OS.

And from 9to5google.com Work on this Fuchsia project within Android — dubbed “device/google/fuchsia” — stalled in February 2021, with no public indication of how things were progressing. This week, all of the code for “device/google/fuchsia” was removed from Android, formally signaling the end of this particular avenue.

In its place, we have a lone “TODO” message, suggesting that Google may be building up something new in its place. The developer responsible for the change primarily works on Fuchsia’s “Starnix” project.

First shared in early 2021 as a proposal, Starnix is designed to make it possible for Fuchsia to “natively” run apps and libraries that were built for Linux or Android. To do this, Starnix would act to translate the low-level kernel instructions from what Linux expects to what Fuchsia’s Zircon kernel expects.

So ... custom kernel and a custom OS that will support Android applications as far as I understand ...

Re: Google vs. the Open Web

#67

Post by xNeil »

Daril wrote: post #41

This is a clear sign of Google's weakness. They are losing their monopoly and are desperately trying to hold on to the net. In the last few weeks, they have announced that they will try to block navigation if you have an ad blocker installed (for example, when watching a video on Youtube). Take a look at Fuchsia for another example ... they are losing the control on Android, so they started this new project ... it is…

>Google will lose all respect from the community and will collapse sooner or later.

I love this little bubble all of HN (or at least a vocal majority) seems to live in. Google is most definitely not collapsing anytime soon, and their products are loved by millions, if not billions, of users all over the world.

>They are losing their monopoly

No, they most definitely aren't. Brave Browser runs on top of Google's Chromium. Firefox runs on top of Google's money. Their lead in search does not seem to be going away anytime soon - there is a reason literally everyone on earth uses Google as a search engine. There is a reason literally everyone on earth uses YouTube to watch any video they want. There is a reason 70% of all phone users use Google's operating system. There is a reason Gmail is by far and away the clear leader in the personal email space.

>They have announced that they will try to block navigation if you have an ad blocker installed (for example when watching a video on YouTube).

As they rightly can. You are under no obligation to use YouTube - and if you do use it, you must pay for it, either by watching ads, or by paying for YouTube Premium.

HN can keep complaining about Google all they want, but Google is one of the few companies that has truly made the Internet the Internet. Their impact on humanity has a whole has so far most definitely been net positive, and you are under no obligation whatsoever to use their products. There is a reason they are the clear leader in the products they offer, and that is because they offer, say, a free tier (as in Gmail), or openness (as in Android).

Re: Google vs. the Open Web

#68

Post by CalRobert »

Daril wrote: post #51
andsoitis wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They are losing their monopoly and are desperately trying to hold on to the net > they are losing the control on Android What do you mean by this and what does Android have to do with trying to hold on to the net?

I mean, there are now many other open source projects based on Android (LineageOS and e/OS/ for example) that are free from Google. If they can't control the operating system on your phone because it's free from their services, they can't control your device, track you and send you their ads... I've been using e/OS/ for 3 years now on a phone made in Germany (Gigaset). There is always an alternative...

LineageOS is a great illustration of how Google is winning. Years ago I could use LineageOS or Cyanogenmod as my primary phone just fine. Now it's very hard to do that if I want to be able to use an increasing number of apps (banking comes to mind). And now I won't be able to bank with Firefox, either.

Re: Google vs. the Open Web

#70

Post by Dah00n »

Communitivity wrote: post #38

Another year closer to a Shadowrun future, minus the magic, where the most powerful corporations run everything, are more powerful than most nation states, and where your only allowed role in life is a consumer/corpse-servant for life (unless you want to risk the harsh penalties of being illegal and running the shadows). I think we will get to a PostCapitalist future. The decisions we make in the next 7 years will li…

Unless the US disappears it seems pretty clear which of those two choices we will end up with, unless of course there are other choices.
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