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Unesco calls for global ban on smartphones in schools

theguardian.com

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Re: Unesco calls for global ban on smartphones in schools

#61

Post by xwdv »

MisterTea wrote: post #47
xwdv wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We did just fine in schools before smartphones. Perhaps even better .

Another thing to think about is how these things obliterate creativity - In school If I was bored I would doodle in the back of my notebooks during class. Drawings of things, places, trying to do nature scenes. But mostly drawings of machinery, robots and electronics nonsense. Towards senor year when I learned some programming it was code. Those little ephemera works feel important - exercises of the mind, creativity…

Aye, I even remember that sometimes my solution to boredom was to skip ahead to some farther chapters and look for new content to learn.

Kids these days suck.

Re: Unesco calls for global ban on smartphones in schools

#62

Post by shortrounddev2 »

theshrike79 wrote: post #14
shortrounddev2 wrote: post #2

We've come full circle. When I was in high school (2013), smartphones had just started to become the default (i had a galaxy s2) and cell phones had been banned in-class since they became common for every teenager to have one (as early as 2007 for me, probably earlier than that for older millennials) I guess at some point teachers gave up trying to enforce the rules. Or the idea of being away from your phone for hour…

When I was in school, we broke a teacher's curriculum by me having a digital camera (Agfa CL20) The teacher's process was to put a slide on the projector and have everyone write it down. Repeat until class is over, maybe with minimal discussion. I just snapped a picture of a slide and told the teacher to move to the next one, I already sent it to everyone in class =)

I bet they hated you lol

Re: Unesco calls for global ban on smartphones in schools

#63

Post by falcolas »

brigadier132 wrote: post #55
dotnet00 wrote: post #50

Going against HN's usual anti-smartphone thing, I think this is incredibly dumb. Luckily no one really cares much about what UNESCO calls for. Outright bans on smartphones in schools are no different from the video game, TV screen time, "kids will only play games on computers" and other related superstitions that were in vogue back in the early 2000s. All they did was make parents feel validated (without having to pu…

> Outright bans on smartphones in schools are no different from the video game, TV screen time Back then kids were not watching tv or playing video games in the middle of class. I remember when I was in school people were texting on their flip phones, I can't imagine the extent of distractions in school today. I used to pay attention in class only because there was nothing more entertaining to do. If I had a phone an…

> playing video games in the middle of class.

Laughs in GameBoy.

Seriously, you have to be elder gen x or older to exist in a time where handheld consoles of some flavor were not available. And there’s always been other forms of entertainment, be it passing notes, talking, or daydreaming.

Re: Unesco calls for global ban on smartphones in schools

#64

Post by verve_rat »

bgribble wrote: post #42

My kid just graduated from a NYC high school that had a complete ban on phones in school. The kids checked in their phones at the front desk on the way in and got them back when leaving. It was by no means watertight -- many (most?) kids had a "burner" phone that was dead or broken or whatever that they turned in (because nobody would believe a highschooler who said they didn't have their phone with them lol) and the…

Did 12 year olds take the subway to school 20, 30 years ago?

(Genuinely asking, never lived in a place with a subway, but took the bus all the time at that age.)

Re: Unesco calls for global ban on smartphones in schools

#65

Post by vacuity »

tankfox wrote: post #53
gonzo41 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You enforce discipline from an extrinsic source until the expectations are understood and self discipline takes over. Works with dogs, soldiers and kids the same. Doesn't work with cats sadly. And the best thing you can do is model the behavior of putting your phone away and out of sight for things like meals and family time.

This is exactly how we fought the war on drugs! I'm sure it will go great!

It's sad how addiction implies "be more tolerating because it'll happen anyways and be worse if you aren't", though.

I'm not saying that addicted people should just be thrown aside. At the same time, since addiction implies an altered mental state like insanity, addicted people are clearly a burden to society that can't be reasoned with. In general, people have their circumstances that lead them to do what they do, but addicted people may stay addicted even if their circumstances are somehow resolved. Addiction is a costly affair to individuals, their friends and families, and the state. We should try to rehabilitate addicted people and we should try to tackle the root causes (much easier spoken than done), but it's a lousy situation in the first place.

Re: Unesco calls for global ban on smartphones in schools

#66

Post by retrac »

bgribble wrote: post #42

My kid just graduated from a NYC high school that had a complete ban on phones in school. The kids checked in their phones at the front desk on the way in and got them back when leaving. It was by no means watertight -- many (most?) kids had a "burner" phone that was dead or broken or whatever that they turned in (because nobody would believe a highschooler who said they didn't have their phone with them lol) and the…

> My 12 year old can take the subway to school by himself, but ONLY if he has a phone in case he ends up in some wackadoodle situation where his train has gone express or is on another train line and he needs to call his lifeline (me!) to figure out how to work it out.

I was taking the subway to school by myself at 12 in Toronto (maybe a slightly less intense city, to be fair). I'm not sure about NYC but in Toronto it's possible to teach a kid a set of strategies where they'll basically never get dangerously-lost.

Just find the nearest bus, and get on it. Stay on it until it arrives at a subway station. Ask a transit worker at the station if necessary. Get on another bus or subway that gets you a little closer in the right direction. It can take a while but you can follow this algorithm rather blindly and it will get you there. (The system was designed that way, I think.)

I never got lost. And if I had gotten lost, I wouldn't have been in any particular danger. At a certain age they'll have to figure out "oh, there's no bus, what do I do?" on their own. (At the time, I did not like this whole take the subway on my own thing - scared the heck out of me. I had to be coached with multiple trial runs.)

Re: Unesco calls for global ban on smartphones in schools

#67

Post by brigadier132 »

falcolas wrote: post #63
brigadier132 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Outright bans on smartphones in schools are no different from the video game, TV screen time Back then kids were not watching tv or playing video games in the middle of class. I remember when I was in school people were texting on their flip phones, I can't imagine the extent of distractions in school today. I used to pay attention in class only because there was nothing more entertaining to do. If I had a phone an…

> playing video games in the middle of class. Laughs in GameBoy. Seriously, you have to be elder gen x or older to exist in a time where handheld consoles of some flavor were not available. And there’s always been other forms of entertainment, be it passing notes, talking, or daydreaming.

My teacher would have ripped the gameboy out of my hand and confiscated it for the rest of the school year. Teachers do not that have that kind of freedom today.

Also, if your argument is "gameboy existed". People just did not use it as much. Today smartphone usage in class is rampant. Also gameboy games were not anywhere near as addicting as games and social media are today.

Re: Unesco calls for global ban on smartphones in schools

#68

Post by [deleted] »

carlosjobim wrote: post #35
DavidPeiffer wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have had coworkers who wanted to stick with a dumb phone. It sounds great to give junior a dumb phone until they're "old enough", but not much communication happens via sms. It's all done in other apps. Your kids will be excluded from a lot of conversations and events. They will feel ostricized socially and will inevitably be frustrated at you because of it. Having no phone versus a dumb phone would make the resent…

> Your kids will be excluded from a lot of conversations and events. Raising your children is the most important thing anybody does in their life. It's not something you do alone, but there is a hierarchy on who should have the most say in raising your children. The hierarchy is something like this: 1. The parents 2. Close family 3. Other parents in the community (if you have such community) 4. Close friends of the p…

[deleted]

Re: Unesco calls for global ban on smartphones in schools

#69

Post by theshrike79 »

Beldur wrote: post #8

Not sure about you guys, but I plan to not give my kids a phone until they reach at least the age of 14 (7 and 3 atm) Is this realistic? Any experiences?

It's like prohibition, the forbidden fruit. Denial will only increase the want. It's better to teach moderation early than it is to try to curb the want for 7+ years.

My kid has had an iPad from age 1 or so, with kiosk mode enabled and a baby game that made funny noises when they slapped the screen.

They got a phone at age 7, just before starting first grade. No Youtube, no TikTok and screen time enforced per category and per program. The only one I "cheated" the age with was WhatsApp, because it's the default communication tool over here.

It's about 5 years later and I've still managed to keep them off Youtube by giving more screen time in Netflix/Disney+/our PBS equivalent etc, where the content is actually produced and not some youtube elsagate horror show or a screaming influencer hawking off whatever a sponsor is telling them to sell this week.

At this point asking for screen time with good grounds is a habit for the kid: "Homework is done and I read The Trials of Morrigan Crow for 30 minutes, can I get screen time?" It's also used mostly for background noise, iPad is on a stand somewhere with a random show running and they're drawing or doing some crafts while it's playing.

The rule we follow is that every 15 minute slot spent reading (comics or books) is given out double as screen time.

Re: Unesco calls for global ban on smartphones in schools

#70

Post by DoingIsLearning »

jweir wrote: post #36
soligern wrote: post #29

I support this completely. I would go the extra step of not making internet capable phones accessible to under 14 year olds in general.

Smart watches too. Big distraction problem in my son’s grade school and they are used on math tests.

I don't know about that one. You have some smart watches for kids. Which are basically a geolocator + phone home + panic button.

I have friends who's kids use those to go to school on their own. I feel that is a good compromise between parents anxiety and kids autonomy. Provided you make it clear to them that the watch enables you to track them.

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