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Unesco calls for global ban on smartphones in schools

theguardian.com

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Re: Unesco calls for global ban on smartphones in schools

#31

Post by horeszko »

mapierce2 wrote: post #11

I don't see a more elegant solution than this, but it's a bummer. Smartphones are so useful; the world's information AND a computer in your pocket! The ideal would be to give students and parents an avenue to remove/combat the addictive elements of their smartphones, but most students (and parents) don't see those elements as a problem, but a feature.

I view smart phones as two dimensional.

On one dimension they are a tool (like a Sheika Slate in Zelda).

On the other dimension they are a toy.

The problem for schools is that the tool and the toy are packaged together.

A further problem is that smartphones are consumer electronic devices, so businesses will strive to make them as addictive as possible and are unlikely to support creating some kind of separation between toy and tool.

So I agree that a ban is probably the best solution at this point. A ban with legal backing so schools can focus on education and not combating distraction.

Re: Unesco calls for global ban on smartphones in schools

#32

Post by stathibus »

rationalist wrote: post #22
DavidPeiffer wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have had coworkers who wanted to stick with a dumb phone. It sounds great to give junior a dumb phone until they're "old enough", but not much communication happens via sms. It's all done in other apps. Your kids will be excluded from a lot of conversations and events. They will feel ostricized socially and will inevitably be frustrated at you because of it. Having no phone versus a dumb phone would make the resent…

I think the next logical step would be to find a community of like-minded parents and set those kids up to be friends.

Parents can't just get together and decide that their 14 year olds are going to be friends.

Re: Unesco calls for global ban on smartphones in schools

#33

Post by pantalaimon »

MarioCircuit wrote: post #25
Beldur wrote: post #8

Not sure about you guys, but I plan to not give my kids a phone until they reach at least the age of 14 (7 and 3 atm) Is this realistic? Any experiences?

As someone who didn't have a phone until 12 or 13, please do, BUT make sure you do it right. I use my phone for maybe 5 minutes a day excluding essential stuff, have 0 social media, and have no interest in increasing either number. If you just hold it over their head, they'll go find some other kid whose parents' entire parenting philosophy is "give iPad". You should make sure to explain to them why you're restrictin…

It isn’t even so much spying/bad content that I’d be worried about but much more that addictive nature of online communication. Many adults struggle with it and kids in particular should first learn how to communicate with people in real life and pay attention to school before they can escape to the online realm.

School can be boring and a smartphone is just a too welcome distraction.

Re: Unesco calls for global ban on smartphones in schools

#34

Post by NikolaNovak »

Beldur wrote: post #8

Not sure about you guys, but I plan to not give my kids a phone until they reach at least the age of 14 (7 and 3 atm) Is this realistic? Any experiences?

Depends on your goals.

If your goal is for your kids to not have access to smartphone apps, dangers and distractions, I fear it'll fail spectacularly.

If your goal is to build self reliance and problem solving skills, you may succeed in unintended ways.

I was born in 1979. I touched my first computer probably at age 6. I programmed in GWbasic when I was 10 or so, started turbo Pascal and oracle db lessons when I was 11. War started when I was 12, my dad got wounded when walking to work, and I was basically a fully fledged prepubescent adult partially responsible for family survival. And I am not special. (This is lateral to the meticulous way I built a flame thrower at 12 as well:)

Point is, 12 and 13 year olds are smart and resourceful and have a lot of time and motivation to outwit you. We somehow forget our 12 year old selves when we become adults. I reread enders game when I need to remind myself (my initial reaction to the book was "what a horribly unrealistic way to portray kids, they think like adults", followed by the realization I did think like that as a kid! We just start telling ourselves weird tales of superiority as we get old).

You are not repeat not going to successfully keep your kids from this stuff until they're 14. My 12 year old niece who is like the most innocent person I know taught me more about dark Web than I knew. You don't raise your child in isolation. They'll learn from you but also hundred other kids. You can hope to be involved and maybe, maybe guide. I fear that by not giving them access yourself in a guided fashion, all you'll be doing is ensuring they have it in unguided fashion.

(Fwiw I have a 2 and 4 year old and struggle with exact same questions coming up)

Re: Unesco calls for global ban on smartphones in schools

#35

Post by carlosjobim »

DavidPeiffer wrote: post #16
Beldur wrote: post #8

Not sure about you guys, but I plan to not give my kids a phone until they reach at least the age of 14 (7 and 3 atm) Is this realistic? Any experiences?

I have had coworkers who wanted to stick with a dumb phone. It sounds great to give junior a dumb phone until they're "old enough", but not much communication happens via sms. It's all done in other apps. Your kids will be excluded from a lot of conversations and events. They will feel ostricized socially and will inevitably be frustrated at you because of it. Having no phone versus a dumb phone would make the resent…

> Your kids will be excluded from a lot of conversations and events.

Raising your children is the most important thing anybody does in their life. It's not something you do alone, but there is a hierarchy on who should have the most say in raising your children. The hierarchy is something like this:

1. The parents

2. Close family

3. Other parents in the community (if you have such community)

4. Close friends of the parents

5. Tutors, coaches and teachers

6. Responsible and respected adults in the community

7. Any adult

8. Any teenager

9. Criminal gangs

10. Television and Hollywood

11. Silicon Valley companies

12. Government workers

Now, if a child gets excluded from not having a smart phone, it seems that everybody above number 11 are somewhat or blatantly neglecting their duties. Get together with other parents and start taking control back from number 11 in raising your children.

Re: Unesco calls for global ban on smartphones in schools

#38

Post by nottorp »

kwanbix wrote: post #7
nottorp wrote: post #6

How about teaching kids self control and concentration?

Because these things are addictive? You can say the same for drugs, alcohol, and most people that consume those are adults, how can you expect kids to do what adults can't? You see 90% of people in the buses, trains looking their phones like idiots (including me). It is very difficult because it creates addiction.

Have those adults been taught about self control and concentration in school?

Re: Unesco calls for global ban on smartphones in schools

#39

Post by veave »

Since the cat is out of the bag regarding mandatory education, I don't support this.

Allowing kids to use smartphones freely in schools 1) will act as a very good filter and 2) will keep the most annoying kids entertained thus allowing the kids who pass through the former filter to learn without interruptions.

The way it works now, we're just going for the lowest common denominator. The results are obvious.

Re: Unesco calls for global ban on smartphones in schools

#40

Post by Shrezzing »

rationalist wrote: post #22
DavidPeiffer wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have had coworkers who wanted to stick with a dumb phone. It sounds great to give junior a dumb phone until they're "old enough", but not much communication happens via sms. It's all done in other apps. Your kids will be excluded from a lot of conversations and events. They will feel ostricized socially and will inevitably be frustrated at you because of it. Having no phone versus a dumb phone would make the resent…

I think the next logical step would be to find a community of like-minded parents and set those kids up to be friends.

Having been a teenager once myself, I can attest that there's nothing in this world that'd more successfully ostricize a kid socially, than grouping them with other isolated kids.
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