Google vs. the Open Web
interpeer.io
Google vs. the Open Web
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Re: Google vs. the Open Web
#2The link to Yoav Weiss's blog is great.
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So, you don't like a web platform proposal
...you may feel that your insights and experience can be valuable to help steer the platform from making what you're sure is a huge mistake. That's great!! Getting involved in web platform discussions is essential to ensure it's built for and by everyone.
...
In cases where controversial browser proposals (or lack of adoption for features folks want, which is a related, but different, subject), it's not uncommon to see issues with dozens or even hundreds of comments from presumably well-intentioned folks, trying to influence the team working on the feature to change their minds.
In the many years I've been working on the web platform, I've yet to see this work. Not even once.
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"We do so love for everyone to join the discussion. It also never influences our decisions, not once"
Re: Google vs. the Open Web
#3Soon, websites will require kernel access to make sure you don't have cheats installed. (Sarcasm, obviously)
Re: Google vs. the Open Web
#4Soon, websites will require kernel access to make sure you don't have cheats installed. (Sarcasm, obviously)
Not that extreme but some banking apps on android did check for root at some point and refused to run so there may be precedent
Re: Google vs. the Open Web
#5The bright side is, when Google really pushes through with this WEI nonsense, it will not only break the Web, it will also create some kind of premium Web run by Google, analogous to gated communities. And then the worldwide Internet ad market bubble will finally burst.
Re: Google vs. the Open Web
#6The link to Yoav Weiss's blog is great. --- start quote --- So, you don't like a web platform proposal ...you may feel that your insights and experience can be valuable to help steer the platform from making what you're sure is a huge mistake. That's great!! Getting involved in web platform discussions is essential to ensure it's built for and by everyone. ... In cases where controversial browser proposals (or lack o…
There's two aspects to that actually.
1. Often the feedback goes completely to the wrong address. You won't stop Google from doing google things. 2. Most often the depth level at which the discussions on web standard are made will alienate most people, so instead of participating in "standards making" they turn somewhere else (1.).
The web is awesome and it got awesome because for the first 15 years of its existence it was actually very straight forward to run a web entity. But success brought ever growing companies and ever more complex interests. The discussions also vary a lot nowadays. There are still things being done to make the web more approachable but at the same time we see stuff like "Web Environment Integrity", DRM etc.
The problem is that a process that requires the public to be vigilant will eventually fail if the public cannot appoint people to be vigilant full time for them.
Re: Google vs. the Open Web
#7The link to Yoav Weiss's blog is great. --- start quote --- So, you don't like a web platform proposal ...you may feel that your insights and experience can be valuable to help steer the platform from making what you're sure is a huge mistake. That's great!! Getting involved in web platform discussions is essential to ensure it's built for and by everyone. ... In cases where controversial browser proposals (or lack o…
Clearly the implication is that rushing to join a professional discussion just to yell about some or another controversial proposal you read about on HN is not going to work to sway the stakeholders. If you want influence, you need to cultivate it over time by building trust in the community you want to influence. That's hardly controversial.
In particular, taking a fairly dry proposal like WEI, which is intended as a anti-bot/anti-cheat framework for web content, and spinning it with a shitpost title like "Google vs. the Open Web" is really not going to ingratiate you with the people who think hard about very difficult problems every day.
Is it a good proposal? Honestly I don't know. But the problems it's trying to address are real, so I'm inclined to give the benefit of the doubt to the people trying to solve them in good faith over the shitposters.
Re: Google vs. the Open Web
#8The bright side is, when Google really pushes through with this WEI nonsense, it will not only break the Web, it will also create some kind of premium Web run by Google, analogous to gated communities. And then the worldwide Internet ad market bubble will finally burst.
GoogAOL Web 3.0
Re: Google vs. the Open Web
#9How does WEI work with non-browsers, like curl or python requests? I was wondering if there is some motive here to monopolize web scraping (especially with respect to harvesting AI training data)?
Re: Google vs. the Open Web
#10Soon, websites will require kernel access to make sure you don't have cheats installed. (Sarcasm, obviously)
Not that extreme but some banking apps on android did check for root at some point and refused to run so there may be precedent
In the 2000s it was funny how corporates just failed to understand how client server models worked. Nowadays it is just sad and a reason to move more and more towards crypto for the day to day banking stuff...