Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote • Hacker News Board

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#191

Post by ryneandal » Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 4:58 PM UTC

Aurornis wrote: post #83

ryneandal wrote: post #5

I've been working remotely for nearly seven years now. I've been able to enjoy all of the typical "firsts" for my youngest two, saved immense amounts of time with no commute, and have been able to pitch in more regarding domestic tasks. I understand and empathize with those that value face-to-face conversations in the office, but for those that don't, remote work is an incredible boon.

I've been remote for a similar amount of time. Likewise, I've enjoyed the time saved on commutes. Since COVID I've felt like the dynamic of my remote work experience has changed. I've worked with two remote companies since then and both were struggling with a lot of inexperienced or absent remote workers. Dealing with them on a case-by-case basis is the right call, of course, but it takes a toll on management's trust…

I found my current employer prior to COVID, and they had been almost exclusively remote since their inception in the early aughts. Companies with remote-first culture that predate COVID are far better equipped for the cons regarding remote work (IMO), of which there are plenty.

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#192

Post by dv_dt » Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 4:59 PM UTC

zer8k wrote: post #28

> on HN The most important subtext. There are engineer friends of mine laid off from remote companies that, almost 5 months later, cannot get work. These aren't braindead seatwarmers either. The software engineer market has shifted under our feet DRAMATICALLY. Any software engineer with a position should try to keep it for as long as they possible can.

This may have more to do with the widespread and multiple layoff-rounds in the major companies in the industry rather than WFH per se.

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#193

Post by isoprophlex » Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 5:00 PM UTC

ryneandal wrote: post #5

I've been working remotely for nearly seven years now. I've been able to enjoy all of the typical "firsts" for my youngest two, saved immense amounts of time with no commute, and have been able to pitch in more regarding domestic tasks. I understand and empathize with those that value face-to-face conversations in the office, but for those that don't, remote work is an incredible boon.

You're an inspiration, and I hope to be able to say the same, seven years from now.

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#194

Post by vbo » Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 5:00 PM UTC

dv_dt wrote: post #157

vbo wrote: post #117

I don't mind working from home, but I find WFH-accommodating calls exhausting; it feels they take far longer than the equivalent in person discussion, in addition to losing the ad-hoc nature of office conversations. The context switch feels heavier on calls than it does in person. Also, the way daily calls tend to be scheduled (everyone at once, let's hash out everything for everyone so we can then get on with things…

It sounds to me like you're WFH in a culture that doesn't do async coordination well. I don't know how large an org you're in, but some targeted team process refresh goals/training for better async coord would seem like it could improve your working environment. (edit: this could be a suggestion put to your team leads/managers with the objective of improving culture & efficiency) Some of that is explicitly writing up…

It's a hybrid 20-ish person team and I work from the office 4 days a week (my choice), but yeah, you're right that we fail at async coordination and fall back onto calls. I've suggested alternatives (meet in the office a couple of days a week) but it has failed to materialise and the only workable solution I found has been to remove myself from noisy/unproductive calls.

I hear what you're saying about docs but knowing everyone I don't feel we could do it. Pre-covid everyone-in-the-office worked well, but you need to drag people into the office these days so it seems we're stuck with an ineffective hodgepodge of calls and in person fractional team chats.

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#195

Post by JambalayaJim » Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 5:01 PM UTC

JohnFen wrote: post #54

rjzzleep wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a question for people here. I absolutely value the time with my daughter and I actually enjoy working for home, I had been for the last couple of years, but it's becoming increasingly unbearable to do that with a nagging and micromanaging partner by my side who's life is COMPLETELY unstructured. So I find myself longing for office time, not because I like office time, but rather because I feel like it might br…

> Am I the only one in that situation? What do you do? What I did (decades ago) was realize that when I was working from home, I needed to treat it the same as working in an office. What that meant was: I need a room that is exclusively "the office". When I'm in there, I'm working. When I'm not working, I'm not in there. And everyone else in the household has to adhere to one rule -- if my office door is closed, they…

It's really frustrating that the discussion is often "just shut yourself in your home office", as if an extra room doesn't rent out for $1000/month in many cities.

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#196

Post by baristaGeek » Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 5:02 PM UTC

cj wrote: post #152

Side note to the remote founders/employers out there: Have you been plagued by applicant fraud? We've found for all of our remote engineering roles, we get 100's of amazing applicants who are all fake (clearly not actually in the US) once you get them on a screening call. They're often reading from a script, broken english, and say strange things like they're born and raised in Texas, yet can't speak fluent English o…

Accent aside (if they can't be understood at all they're obviously not qualified):

What's the difference between a foreigner with an accent in your onsite team VS a foreigner that's remote in US timezones (LatAm)? Why just open the job for US-remote?

Compliance? Deel/Remote can help you with that.

Security? It applies if you're working on defense software, but other than that...?

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#197

Post by dang » Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 5:03 PM UTC

1270018080 wrote: post #154

HDThoreaun wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Salary has never been about the value you provide. It's about the cost to replace you. Companies will never pay you more than you cost to replace.

Which is why we need a union, despite what libertarians think they are above.

> Which is why we need a union, despite what libertarian fetishist tech bros think they are above

Please make your substantive points without snark or name-calling. This is in the site guidelines: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html.

Edit: it's not good to stealth-edit your comments after the fact, especially when doing so deprives replies of their original meaning. If you're going to make an edit that affects conversation in this way, please do it append-only (as I've done here) with an "Edit:" prefix or similar.

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#198

Post by biomcgary » Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 5:04 PM UTC

JambalayaJim wrote: post #131

wfhBrian wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I was able to move closer to my church community, so my "human interaction" need is being fulfilled richer than ever now. This is what the "but you need human interaction" return-to-office crowd doesn't understand. WFH !== Being alone WFH means surrounding yourself with the people you choose to be around. Whether that's your church community, fellow hobbyists, intramural sports teams, the local co-working space, et…

This is a fundamental misunderstanding of what the return-to-office crowd, like myself, wants. Work relationships and personal relationships serve entirely different purposes for me. I don't want to be working longer hours, or make work a larger part of my life. I don't particularly care if I have "real" friendships with my colleagues outside of work. I have plenty of friends and family that I already have trouble ju…

Are we in a transition period where the previous methods of developing camaraderie, etc simply have not been widely learned?

I've worked remotely for 7 years and haven't missed anything you've listed as a benefit of in-person work. In fact, compared to prior in-person experiences, I have more personal interaction with colleagues than before (largely because my startup is quite conscious about it).

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#199

Post by starttoaster » Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 5:05 PM UTC

burlesona wrote: post #162

ravenstine wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's arguments from both sides of the coin but, though I'm biased having worked remote for almost 5 years now, I think the remote-side usually wins the argument by simply being more reasonable. I see far fewer remote workers claiming that "everyone should work remote" and more in-office workers making sweeping claims that remote reduces creativity, reduces, productivity, or makes people lazy. The anti-remote folks…

That's very interesting. My experience has been the opposite, that people who are pro-remote are intense about it, that they often deny there being any benefits to working in an office and get angry and dismissive toward anyone who says they want to work in-person. I would argue that the reason "remote wins" is that to get the full benefit of working in person you really need 100% of your team to work in the same bui…

Would it be fair to say that you skew towards preferring in-person work? I think a possible takeaway here is that we notice people making arguments that we disagree with more than we notice people making arguments that we agree with.

All I can say is true for me, but as an introvert in a creative role (is it fair to call programming a creative role? I think so) being in an office around other people, especially open floorplan offices where we're all able to glare at each other from across our desks, stymies my ability to be creative. I just feel the pressure of being watched all day, and sometimes it clams me up. And then after work I go home feeling exhausted, mentally, and defeated for not getting what I wanted to get done. And when I need help on something in a remote role, I'm able to articulate the problem statement very easily over text, which my coworkers (one or two in particular) are very helpful at pointing me to a solution asynchronously while I hack away at it. So to your argument about the reason that "remote wins", I'd argue there are more reasons that it wins. But that's just for me, and I imagine many other people that also prefer remote.

I don't think in-person work is going anywhere though. I do agree with your perspective that hybrid work seems likely to not be ideal for people that prefer in-person. In fact, I'd argue that hybrid work is not ideal for people that prefer remote either. In my experience you usually have managers questioning your motives for going remote in those hybrid environments, making you feel like you're an inconvenience to the team, and pressuring you to come in some days on a commute that may not be convenient. And then one day some upper management changes, and the new person just decides they prefer an all in-person workforce and tells all the remote people to come back in or be let go. For your sake, I hope you find an opportunity that is 100% in-person. And I also hope those hybrid environments become fewer and farther between.

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#200

Post by AuthorizedCust » Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 5:06 PM UTC

ravenstine wrote: post #159

unshavedyak wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Completely agree. I've long believed that society is just "wrong" with the work/life balance these days. Socially i think we could drop to 6h days and life would improve dramatically (just looking at home time, that is) for most people. For me, just giving up commutes and being able to do some basic chores on breaks or lunch alone brings a ton of this balance back into check. I work 8h but i gained so much "me" time…

It all depends on need . The idea that everything needs to work the same way is unsound. Arguably, the company I work for doesn't need to bring everyone into the office every day; we seem to be doing quite well. Another firm that believes it sees better creativity when people are in the same physical room may be better off not having their workers be remote. And like you say, not every company necessarily gets a bene…

> Another firm that believes it sees better creativity when people are in the same physical room…

“Believes” suggests faith-based decision making. Not sure if you meant to say that, but your weird choice aligns with the credibility of the justifications I see of in-office-only types.