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Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

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Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#161

Post by acuozzo »

bilsbie wrote: post #45

I prefer in office but I don’t see how that’s possible with a family. How would you afford a large enough house in a city center? And otherwise how do you justify two hours of your day to commuting? It just seems like an extreme quality of life hit to be able to work in an office. Am I missing something?

> I prefer in office but I don’t see how that’s possible with a family.

I don't see how WFH is possible with a family. My children (9, 6, and 4) spend nearly the whole day trying to guilt me into playing with them when I telework.

> How would you afford a large enough house in a city center?

Work in an industry which exists largely outside of the cities. Defense, for instance.

> And otherwise how do you justify two hours of your day to commuting?

1 hour in total for me: 30 minutes there and back.

Columbia, MD College Park, MD

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#162

Post by burlesona »

ravenstine wrote: post #85
ryneandal wrote: post #5

I've been working remotely for nearly seven years now. I've been able to enjoy all of the typical "firsts" for my youngest two, saved immense amounts of time with no commute, and have been able to pitch in more regarding domestic tasks. I understand and empathize with those that value face-to-face conversations in the office, but for those that don't, remote work is an incredible boon.

There's arguments from both sides of the coin but, though I'm biased having worked remote for almost 5 years now, I think the remote-side usually wins the argument by simply being more reasonable. I see far fewer remote workers claiming that "everyone should work remote" and more in-office workers making sweeping claims that remote reduces creativity, reduces, productivity, or makes people lazy. The anti-remote folks…

That's very interesting. My experience has been the opposite, that people who are pro-remote are intense about it, that they often deny there being any benefits to working in an office and get angry and dismissive toward anyone who says they want to work in-person.

I would argue that the reason "remote wins" is that to get the full benefit of working in person you really need 100% of your team to work in the same building on the same hours. As soon as one person goes remote, the in-person experience is significantly degraded for everyone else.

Thus, as soon as company allows "hybrid", the people who prefer remote go remote and the in-person experience quickly degrades. This starts a spiral where people on the margin -- who still prefer 100% in person! -- decide it's no-longer worth coming in, which in turn degrades the experience further and pushes more people to give up on the office, until there are very few people left coming in.

It doesn't take very many people to set off this spiral: in my anecdotal experience, once a team goes 10-20% remote, the office is pretty useless.

So what I see is there's a "tyranny of the minority" effect. I think the long-term response is going to be more sorting of companies into all-remote or all in-person, with fewer companies in the "hybrid" space that's so common today.

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#163

Post by john-tells-all »

robswc wrote: post #70

It's weird. I feel like you can get more done at an office at times... but then there's also a lot of downtime. Also the commute is always killer. I honestly believe people work better when they get dressed and have some routine. No idea how people can work in their PJs, I'd feel so lazy, lol. However. The commute is killer. Even if you get it down to just 15 min. (which is hard unless you live right next to work) th…

My commute has always been an hour each way. If the job is going well this isn't bad (podcasts and Audible), but it's a time sink.

One day I realized I was falling asleep on the hour-long, 12-mile route home. (Los Angeles traffic is no joke.) I sold my car and now use metro/bus to commute, or do remote work.

ps: I also can't work from home in my PJs, I "dress up" by putting on jeans :-D

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#165

Post by ravenstine »

ahtihn wrote: post #151
ravenstine wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's arguments from both sides of the coin but, though I'm biased having worked remote for almost 5 years now, I think the remote-side usually wins the argument by simply being more reasonable. I see far fewer remote workers claiming that "everyone should work remote" and more in-office workers making sweeping claims that remote reduces creativity, reduces, productivity, or makes people lazy. The anti-remote folks…

> Nobody's telling you not to drive to an office every day. This argument doesn't work because it's not about being in aspecific physical location, it's about being in the same physical location as all the other workers. When half the people you need to interact with are remote, there's no point going to the office.

That doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. If half the people you're interacting with are in the office, isn't there something to still be gained by interacting with them in the same physical space? There might be a detraction by having the other half work remotely, but why would that outweigh the positives of working in-office? All you'd have to do is get the remote workers on a call or Zoom, which you'd do at home anyway, except you could also meet in-person with other coworkers. I guess I don't see how there's "no point." Apparently, in your example, the positives of just working at home outweigh the advantages of working in-office when both are proportionally 50/50.

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#166

Post by jdwithit »

rjzzleep wrote: post #49
dimitrios1 wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have been working full time remote since Sept 2021 (correction, 2020, just before pandemic). It's not even that I don't value the face-to-face conversations and human interaction, I absolutely do. It just doesn't come close to the immense value I gain by WFH. A side benefit: I was able to move closer to my church community, so my "human interaction" need is being fulfilled richer than ever now. (One of the most fru…

I have a question for people here. I absolutely value the time with my daughter and I actually enjoy working for home, I had been for the last couple of years, but it's becoming increasingly unbearable to do that with a nagging and micromanaging partner by my side who's life is COMPLETELY unstructured. So I find myself longing for office time, not because I like office time, but rather because I feel like it might br…

Definitely sympathize, you are not alone. I have a wife and two young kids. I love her but for a long time my wife just did not consider me as "at work" when I was working remotely. She had zero qualms about coming into our home office to chat or see if I could change a diaper or whatever. I'm happy to help out if I'm between tasks (hell that's one of the perks of WFH, and everyone takes breaks wherever you're working. I'm taking one to write this post!) but it was all day every day and driving me up the wall. Plus toddlers don't care about work hours, if they want to see daddy they're going to come see daddy. We had plenty of conversations about how disruptive it is to have someone tap you on the shoulder while coding to ask if you can run to the grocery store for milk. But it never went anywhere. To her, if I was physically in the house, I was available to do stuff at any time.

To be honest we never "solved" it. Eventually the younger reached kindergarten age and my wife returned to full time work. I wish I had better advice. The suggestion to have a dedicated office space with a door is a good one, but if your partner does not respect boundaries that won't be enough. If finances allow, you could look at leasing a part time desk in a coworking space or even a dedicated office. I know it feels silly to pay for office space when you can do the job from home, but if it's damaging your relationship, it may be worthwhile. Some employers might even offer a stipend for remote workers to help offset costs. The fact that you refer to your partner as a nagging micromanager tells me something has to change.

I hope this post doesn't make me sound like a dick. I have immense respect for my wife for choosing to pause her career to care for our children. Raising kids is HARD, harder than the work I get paid for to be honest. We're partners in life and parenthood. But my role in the partnership at that time was to hold down a job and that's a lot harder to do when you're being interrupted 10 times a day. Hope you are able to work something out.

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#167

Post by CoastalCoder »

freedomben wrote: post #109
CoastalCoder wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did this as well. It took a little time, and a few rebukes, for my kids to understand it as a hard rule. But after that it's been smooth sailing. It also helps that I majorly soundproofed my home office. Even well-intentioned kids will won't be silent for the entire work day.

I should try the soundproofing. 10 years in and the kids still don't leave me alone, and the rebukes were taking a real toll on the relationship. I work part time in a coworking space which has helped a bit, but it's a real struggle.

Let me know if you want to discuss soundproofing details. I'm happy to share some lessons learned.

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#168

Post by deckard1 »

Zetice wrote: post #104

Not only do I despise remote working, I'm leaving the industry entirely as a direct result of working remotely, in favor of getting a law degree. I'm just beyond sick and tired of my default mode being, "Stare at screen to solve problems." I want to work with people, solve problems with people, help people. None of that is what most engineers in software prefer, and I'm tired of trying to force it on them for the app…

you're really going to be in for a shock once you get your law degree. Good luck with that.

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#169

Post by nonethewiser »

Aurornis wrote: post #89
tayo42 wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Companies are being cheap. Software engineers are only providing 200k dollars worth of value? I find that hard to believe.

Compensation isn't proportional to the value you produce. It never was. The hiring market is a market. Prices in a market are set by supply and demand. The value you produce only sets an upper limit on your compensation because companies don't want to lose money by employing people.

> The hiring market is a market. Prices in a market are set by supply and demand.

Demand for software engineers is partially explained by the value software engineers generate.

The value a job creates is obviously a factor. Imagine a job that creates absolutely no value but has a limited supply of qualified people. It wont even exist let alone pay anything.

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#170

Post by aa1234556 »

TacticalCoder wrote: post #155
ryneandal wrote: post #5

I've been working remotely for nearly seven years now. I've been able to enjoy all of the typical "firsts" for my youngest two, saved immense amounts of time with no commute, and have been able to pitch in more regarding domestic tasks. I understand and empathize with those that value face-to-face conversations in the office, but for those that don't, remote work is an incredible boon.

> saved immense amounts of time with no commute, and have been able to pitch in more regarding domestic tasks Same with my kid. Another big win of remote for me is that I can go where I'm treated best. I can pick a country (anyone could pick my country and I had to welcome them with open hands, so it's only fair game that in exchange I'm allowed to go wherever I feel like going) which welcomes me and my family and wh…

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