Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote • Hacker News Board

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#81

Post by bamfly » Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 4:15 PM UTC

Invictus0 wrote: post #43

zer8k wrote: post #28

> on HN The most important subtext. There are engineer friends of mine laid off from remote companies that, almost 5 months later, cannot get work. These aren't braindead seatwarmers either. The software engineer market has shifted under our feet DRAMATICALLY. Any software engineer with a position should try to keep it for as long as they possible can.

cannot get work... at the price they want. Plenty of low-paying remote jobs out there

> low-paying

For high values of "low paying".

$150-250k TC, instead of $300-500k.

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#82

Post by oofta-boofta » Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 4:16 PM UTC

shmatt wrote: post #66

Invictus0 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

cannot get work... at the price they want. Plenty of low-paying remote jobs out there

Im not sure why this is even getting downvoted. Top pay of market has significantly shifted to hybrid. Even once a week in office means you can't live anywhere in the country you'd like. Though i'm not sure if the original article counts hybrid as remote in this case There are plenty of fully remote openings for senior software engineers looking for $100k TC right now. Every person can make their own calculation

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Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#83

Post by Aurornis » Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 4:16 PM UTC

ryneandal wrote: post #5

I've been working remotely for nearly seven years now. I've been able to enjoy all of the typical "firsts" for my youngest two, saved immense amounts of time with no commute, and have been able to pitch in more regarding domestic tasks. I understand and empathize with those that value face-to-face conversations in the office, but for those that don't, remote work is an incredible boon.

I've been remote for a similar amount of time. Likewise, I've enjoyed the time saved on commutes.

Since COVID I've felt like the dynamic of my remote work experience has changed. I've worked with two remote companies since then and both were struggling with a lot of inexperienced or absent remote workers. Dealing with them on a case-by-case basis is the right call, of course, but it takes a toll on management's trust of remote workers in general.

Fortunately I haven't had to install any overly intrusive monitoring software, but I did learn that my company now dedicates a significant amount of business analyst time to analyzing activity of remote employees now. Apparently they had so many problems with remote employees (and their managers!) barely getting any work done that management has soured on remote work in general, so new hires have to be on site unless someone can vouch for them being excellent remote workers.

The competition for remote work has also gone way up. Every remote job opening we posted would get literally thousands of applications.

The combination of increasing competition for remote jobs and declining sentiment toward remote work (see: Amazon and other big companies) does not bode well for those of us who were successfully working remote for many years, IMO.

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#84

Post by thedangler » Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 4:16 PM UTC

My ideal remote work would be: Be available for meetings that may impact your work, if not work when ever you want but must meet project goals. For example, I'm most productive 10am - 3pm and 9pm - 2am. But I make do with "office hours" that have no bearing on my project dead lines.

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#85

Post by ravenstine » Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 4:16 PM UTC

ryneandal wrote: post #5

I've been working remotely for nearly seven years now. I've been able to enjoy all of the typical "firsts" for my youngest two, saved immense amounts of time with no commute, and have been able to pitch in more regarding domestic tasks. I understand and empathize with those that value face-to-face conversations in the office, but for those that don't, remote work is an incredible boon.

There's arguments from both sides of the coin but, though I'm biased having worked remote for almost 5 years now, I think the remote-side usually wins the argument by simply being more reasonable. I see far fewer remote workers claiming that "everyone should work remote" and more in-office workers making sweeping claims that remote reduces creativity, reduces, productivity, or makes people lazy. The anti-remote folks even go as far as dismissing having the time to be around your kids or saving money by not commuting as being trivial benefits. Like, wtf mate? Nobody's telling you not to drive to an office every day.

Don't get me wrong, there are some remote fanatics that do the same thing, but they seem far fewer.

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#86

Post by HDThoreaun » Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 4:16 PM UTC

wfhBrian wrote: post #29

dimitrios1 wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have been working full time remote since Sept 2021 (correction, 2020, just before pandemic). It's not even that I don't value the face-to-face conversations and human interaction, I absolutely do. It just doesn't come close to the immense value I gain by WFH. A side benefit: I was able to move closer to my church community, so my "human interaction" need is being fulfilled richer than ever now. (One of the most fru…

> I was able to move closer to my church community, so my "human interaction" need is being fulfilled richer than ever now. This is what the "but you need human interaction" return-to-office crowd doesn't understand. WFH !== Being alone WFH means surrounding yourself with the people you choose to be around. Whether that's your church community, fellow hobbyists, intramural sports teams, the local co-working space, et…

I think most of the "but you need human interaction" crowd isn't talking about their social life. It's much harder to collaborate with coworkers when you have no relationship with them. It's not impossible to have a relationship with coworkers when remote, but you have to put a lot more effort in than you would in person. Some companies are facilitating that, but some aren't.

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#87

Post by drones » Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 4:17 PM UTC

Does anyone else think that WeWork, as a concept, still has potential? WFH has a lot of benefits for the employee, but it's clear that many employers still desire some face-to-face contact. WeWork was already going downhill pre-pandemic, but had it survived I wonder if it may have been the primary service for small/hybrid companies.

I am aware that WW had it's own business issues to deal with, but it's still salvageable, right?

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#88

Post by CoastalCoder » Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 4:17 PM UTC

shmatt wrote: post #66

Invictus0 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

cannot get work... at the price they want. Plenty of low-paying remote jobs out there

Im not sure why this is even getting downvoted. Top pay of market has significantly shifted to hybrid. Even once a week in office means you can't live anywhere in the country you'd like. Though i'm not sure if the original article counts hybrid as remote in this case There are plenty of fully remote openings for senior software engineers looking for $100k TC right now. Every person can make their own calculation

I agree with the parent and grandparent comments.

For me personally, the question is how long I hold out for a job that will pay the bills. E.g., without my kids needing to take out big college loans.

For one thing, I don't want to screw over an employer by taking a job that I know I'll leave as soon as something better-paying becomes available. Hopefully I'll find a decent job before I get that desparate.

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#89

Post by Aurornis » Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 4:18 PM UTC

tayo42 wrote: post #60

Invictus0 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

cannot get work... at the price they want. Plenty of low-paying remote jobs out there

Companies are being cheap. Software engineers are only providing 200k dollars worth of value? I find that hard to believe.

Compensation isn't proportional to the value you produce.

It never was.

The hiring market is a market. Prices in a market are set by supply and demand.

The value you produce only sets an upper limit on your compensation because companies don't want to lose money by employing people.

Re: Remote work on HN: Who is hiring? – 69% jobs in 2023 are remote

#90

Post by dspillett » Tue, Jul 25, 2023, 4:18 PM UTC

Obviously this can only count jobs that say they are remote, I've seen many complaints about remote jobs that turn out to require significant time in an office location.

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Personally I'd prefer not to WFH mostly. While it is very useful to be able to (I have for a day or two here & there for years, and over the last year for a few days at a time while looking after ill parents and a terminal pet) but I hate it full time. Partly it is because I don't have room for a dedicated office and I don't like my work and personal space to mix to readily, and partly it is the contact thing (I'm uncomfortable on phones and video calls, always have been, and some people don't seem to be willing to mail or IM me instead when that would be most efficient by far), and partly I find myself getting more and more distractable the longer I'm working away (this may be largely due to the matter of having no space for a dedicated office space).

I'd rather leave tech than work full time remote, so you might find me stacking shelves in a few years!

We are officially hybrid, but for two or three days of any given week there are only a few people in the office, often not people I'm working directly with, so I'm effectively remote just in an office not at home, so some of the bad parts of both options. I'm not sure if this is any better, and I'm seriously contemplating what my future options may be – those shelves that need stacking are looking oddly attractive, or more practically perhaps retraining as an accountant or something.

Or maybe this is just the midlife crisis rambling!

Or maybe, as I've been accused of a few times, I'm a corporate shill here to extol the virtues of office space.