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All foster kids in California can now attend any state college for free

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Re: All foster kids in California can now attend any state college for free

#551
post #471

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Free police, free firefighters, free roads, etc. It's all free as far as your average layman is concerned.

I don't think anyone thinks free services don't have costs. Everyone (or nearly everyone) understands they are taxpayer funded. Even to the layman.

People spend other people's money differently.

"Taxpayer funded" is a gross oversimplification, for any sort of government entitlement and college funding alike.

But anyway, I have seen students in college who were sent there by their employer. They work full-time, have families with young children, and they were expected to pick up several credit-hours to upskill. You've never seen a bunch of sleepier guys. A lot of people, sent by their employer picking up the tab, don't wanna be there, and it shows. They're really disengaged with the class, and that frustrates classmates and professor alike.

Then there's students whose parents paid for it, and family expectations on them finishing college so they get a "real job", or even support the parents and buy them a nice house soon.

Students who work their way through school adopt another distinct attitude. They will get tired too, but they make every credit-hour count. It's their own money and their own blood, sweat, and tears that bring them to the finish line.

There are students who apply for scholarships and get through college that way. There's all sorts of funding for scholarships: corporate sponsors, non-profits, churches, community-based organizations, philanthropic foundations. Someone came to speak at the fraternity meeting and she said she'd been awarded six million dollars in scholarships. I was unsure how you'd spend all that at a community college, but hey?

People who are spending, or supported by, other people's money spend it differently than if it were their own money in their own bank account with them watching the bills and transactions. The incentives are different. The risk/reward calculation is different. That's how it goes.

Re: All foster kids in California can now attend any state college for free

#552
post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The number of ruling elite is laughably small compared to the number of poor in the United States

And that justifies regressive taxation policies... how?

Sorry, where's the regressive tax policy? If this is being funded by a graduated income tax (like what most states have, or federal income tax), then it's being funded by a progressive tax.

Re: All foster kids in California can now attend any state college for free

#553
post #391
post #380

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"social democrat" - are you sure? the point remains: some services are social goods and should be treated as such, so that "nobody lacks for inability to pay". That's not literally "free" but has the same meaning in practice.

> "social democrat" - are you sure? Pretty sure, yes. Why do you doubt it? > some services are social goods and should be treated as such I'm not disputing that. I'm just taking issue with the marketing strategy. I don't like selling it as "free education" because that's a lie, and I don't like lying because it catches up with you eventually. I think it should be called what it is: government-subsidized education. (I…

Should we call all grocery stores 'government subsidized food stores' since American AG receives a huge amount of government subsidies? Gas stations 'government subsidized gas stations' or maybe 'government owned' since a large amount of US oilfields are on US government owned land via leases? Should anything that is government subsidized should have some pejorative prefix added to it or just free education?

Re: All foster kids in California can now attend any state college for free

#554

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, disagree. College sports generate a significant amount of revenue for the university, which funds scholarships for a huge number of students that otherwise couldn't afford to go there. They have the added benefit of being fun and add entertainment to the college experience.

Where does sports revenue come from? Isn't it ultimately parents of students and the general populace? College sports aren't exactly an export like oil or software.

A lot comes from tv contracts which are usually paid for by advertisements or subscriptions. Some of that advertising could be from foreign companies.

Re: All foster kids in California can now attend any state college for free

#555

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those countries were created by Europeans, they didn’t exist before that. The tribes that were there before were not much of a civilization. They weren’t behind the rest of the world because of colonialism, they were colonized because they were behind the rest of the world.

Behind the rest of the world how? Technology? Would you say Native Americans were behind? They had a thriving society.

In technology, economy, health, longevity, and general well being. Yes, way behind.

Re: All foster kids in California can now attend any state college for free

#556
post #487

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Does this mean the children is learning? Perhaps. Kids also drink less alcohol, commit less crime, get teenage pregnant less often. So yeah, they are likely to be learning more then in 1970.

It is amazing how many people complain about "kids these days" while every measurable statistics shows that their generstion was much worse.

> It is amazing how many people complain about "kids these days" while every measurable statistics shows that their generstion was much worse.

> drink less alcohol, commit less crime, get teenage pregnant less often

Stats lie.

Their doctors give them drugs way more fun than alcohol, all of their crimes are unattributable to them because they're being committed in a virtual world where there is no accountability (it's not the Boomers SWATing each other, DDoSing anything that disagrees with them, and running fraudulent crowdfunding grifts), and the decline in teenage pregnancy has more to do with the entire demographic's sexual interests being fine-tuned to bespoke pornography and/or their own reflections.

Number of school shootings only ever increases, and an entire generation claims to be mentally ill. Something is wrong here.

Re: All foster kids in California can now attend any state college for free

#557
post #478

Why is California uniquely... nice and compassionate to it's people? It's not liberalism because new england is probably even more liberal? Is it the economy? The weather?

Uhh. Google tent cities for a start. California is pretty brutal.

Not really, those people won't be allowed to have tents like that in most states' major cities, california tolerates the fact that they simply exist there

Re: All foster kids in California can now attend any state college for free

#558

Great. Now let's work on striking "foster" and "California" from that headline.

I mean, no. it should be state-by-state thing but if all states implement it then great. but it shouldn't be federally mandated. maximizing state autonomy is a good thing.

I guess that comes down to if you think the USA is actually a country or not.

Historically state autonomy has not been good unless you like living in the premodern era. See for instance Jim Crow and the Dobbs decision.

Re: All foster kids in California can now attend any state college for free

#559
post #391

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "social democrat" - are you sure? Pretty sure, yes. Why do you doubt it? > some services are social goods and should be treated as such I'm not disputing that. I'm just taking issue with the marketing strategy. I don't like selling it as "free education" because that's a lie, and I don't like lying because it catches up with you eventually. I think it should be called what it is: government-subsidized education. (I…

Should we call all grocery stores 'government subsidized food stores' since American AG receives a huge amount of government subsidies? Gas stations 'government subsidized gas stations' or maybe 'government owned' since a large amount of US oilfields are on US government owned land via leases? Should anything that is government subsidized should have some pejorative prefix added to it or just free education?

Are the grocery stores in your area advertised as “free”? Mine aren’t.

Re: All foster kids in California can now attend any state college for free

#560

I'm all for making education more accessible, but why does it have to be one extreme or the other (free or tuition) - if taxpayers are making education free, can't we levy a requirement for the graduate to at least volunteer Peace Corps style? Perhaps the term of volunteering could be inversely proportional to their grade such that someone who drops out early has to volunteer for a longer period of time.

It's not volunteering if you are forced to do it.

Agreed. From the JFK mindset of “Ask not what your country can do for you - ask what you can do for your country”, I could see a system where a certain level of volunteering (either by the students or their surrogates - parents, grandparents, siblings, friends, etc) might make one eligible for discounted/free tuition.
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