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US Citizens Will Need Visa to Travel to Europe in 2024

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Re: US Citizens Will Need Visa to Travel to Europe in 2024

#51
First the US required visa-free travellers to get travel authorisation beforehand, and pay $10 for the privilege, then Canada did the same, South Korea also started doing it, I'm sure plenty of other countries too, and now it's the EU.

I wonder when the EU will start reciprocating on all the financial reporting bullshit that banks have to do when dealing with US persons.

Re: US Citizens Will Need Visa to Travel to Europe in 2024

#52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The context is missing here. It is important to remember that many Americans visit the EU for short stays and tourism, while in the US, some people from various countries, including India, come for longer durations or even with intentions to stay permanently. The sheer volume of visa applications and varying lengths of stay could contribute to longer processing times.

Many Indians also want to visit the EU/US for short days and tourism, or for other very valid and legitimate reasons. These can be with a long history of not breaking visa norms of other countries, and yet face delays of 2+ years. It's not that these delays cannot be reduced; there's just no will to do that. It makes my blood boil that I have to endure a disproportionate burden of proof on myself: - demonstrate good…

as a US citizen, I'll give you the straight truth. it comes down to racism. indians come in and pretty much dominate wherever they go. most hotels and gas stations (and hospitals and pharmaceuticals) are indian/Chinese dominated industries and the whites need some level of protectionism to compete.

Re: US Citizens Will Need Visa to Travel to Europe in 2024

#53

The wait times for US Tourist Visas for Indians is 1-2 years right now. I have a friend who applied 3 months and her interview date is in January 2025. I mean, I'm not saying you shouldn't complain about this, but I find it funny that Americans are mad about spending the 30 minutes and $30 to fill out a form. Seems entitled.

The context is missing here. It is important to remember that many Americans visit the EU for short stays and tourism, while in the US, some people from various countries, including India, come for longer durations or even with intentions to stay permanently. The sheer volume of visa applications and varying lengths of stay could contribute to longer processing times.

>The context is missing here.

What you provided is not context though, just some word salad rationalization. Visas are a function of bilateral and diplomatic relations which in turn are a function of the power differential between the two parties. That's all there is to it.

Re: US Citizens Will Need Visa to Travel to Europe in 2024

#54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honest question, do you complain that USA implemented this same type program in 2008/2009? Or do you just care now because this affects US travelers?

I wasn't aware EU travellers had to get a visa to enter the US. When I flew to the EU and eastern Europe in 2019, I didn't need a visa. I didn't need to tell anyone my exact dates and itinerary. I paid for a ticket, had a passport, and went.

Yes, we have needed an ESTA for a long time now.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_System_for_Travel...

$20, but you have to apply regularly. They do "something" and you may or may not be approved, and everyone including children need their own one.

Re: US Citizens Will Need Visa to Travel to Europe in 2024

#55

EU really needs to re-do the whole Schengen process for citizens of countries like India. Right now, you need to show booked tickets, hotel reservations, Insurance with very specific terms and a detailed itinerary even before you've been granted the visa. And after all that documentation nightmare, you get granted the visa for the exact specific dates you've requested. God forbid your plans change even by a day or tw…

No, we don't need to change that. You're on a tourist visa. You arrive on day X and you leave on day Y. If circumstances change due to events out of your control, then there are solutions for that. You want better terms, improve the situation in India. Favorable terms are given to citizens of countries where they're unlikely to violate the terms of their visa, like overstaying the validity of their visa.

There literally are no good solutions to that. I went through the whole rigmarole of getting a schengen visa for a specific week and then had to postpone my trip by a week due to change in business plans. The 'solution' was to get a second schengen visa for that second week, by submitting the same documents again and paying the same fee again. Which involves showing up at a consulate in-person. Which are not in every city. (source: https://manila.diplo.de/ph-en/service/visa/faq-gq-change-vis...)

Literally nothing would be different if they decided to grant you the visa for the duration you asked for but allowed you the flexibility to make that trip within a time window. You would still ensure I'm in EU for a limited time, but allowed some flexibility.

Secondly, none of the measures like asking me to show booked hotels or booked flights actually ensures I wont be overstaying. I could very well show you all of those and overstay if i wanted to do so illegally. All it does is forces people to shell out of a bunch of money even before they can be sure I'll be granted the visa.

Re: US Citizens Will Need Visa to Travel to Europe in 2024

#56
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you seem to have strong sense of ownership on your land, maybe your ancestors owned that land for very long time, but keep in mind that your ancestors came from somewhere and nobody denied them the right to stay and live

Around the 13000 years. The previous significant inhabitants left or were wiped out due to the ice age. The idea of a country was established in 800AD. The concept of visas may not have existed at that point in time, but you were at the mercy of those in power. If they didn't like you, they'd banish you from their lands or worse. The modern rules are entirely based on statistics. How many overstay their visa. How man…

Can you share a source to any of these statistics you refer to that the modern rules are based on?

Re: US Citizens Will Need Visa to Travel to Europe in 2024

#57
post #43

I like the fact that there is finally reciprocity with the US citizen having to experience the same shitty rules as when we travel there. But I'm a little bit sad that we will impose the same thing to other visa free travelers. First these countries will probably want to do that also in reciprocity. And secondly it is another marker of the slow decay of public liberties in Europe and the raise of the dictatorial surv…

>finally reciprocity with the US I remember traveling to European countries in the early 80s and needing to cross immigration at each border, but not having to secure a Visa ahead of time for most if any. You were given 30 to 90 days depending on the country. Remember though, the US is one of only three countries (Eritrea, Myanmar are the other 2) that taxes its own citizens even if they have not lived in the US for…

> Remember though, the US is one of only three countries (Eritrea, Myanmar are the other 2) that taxes its own citizens even if they have not lived in the US for years.

These are the kinds of things that can be changed relatively quickly if the government wanted to. I understand for people financially struggling now that isn't encouraging. But there are other factors like access to resources and people that are important.

It's those and the larger term trends that we see that can inform personal choices on immigration.

I know, anticipating hypothetical tricky legislation switches seems like a waste of time. I'm truly sorry I'm wasting your time on that.

Re: US Citizens Will Need Visa to Travel to Europe in 2024

#58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many Indians also want to visit the EU/US for short days and tourism, or for other very valid and legitimate reasons. These can be with a long history of not breaking visa norms of other countries, and yet face delays of 2+ years. It's not that these delays cannot be reduced; there's just no will to do that. It makes my blood boil that I have to endure a disproportionate burden of proof on myself: - demonstrate good…

as a US citizen, I'll give you the straight truth. it comes down to racism. indians come in and pretty much dominate wherever they go. most hotels and gas stations (and hospitals and pharmaceuticals) are indian/Chinese dominated industries and the whites need some level of protectionism to compete.

I try not to get involved in these kinds of discussions. But you lobbed this out there, so I feel like this community can benefit from a personal story.

I'm not white. I'm human. Or just: I am.

I had an Indian friend growing up. Wonderful man. One of the few in our predominantly white township.

His parents owned a hotel.

And they inspired a desire for education and learning in him.

I ran into him in the university town of one of the top state universities one day after being rejected myself. It was awkward, but it also made me happy.

I recognize there are maybe cultural differences with strict parenting styles. But regardless, that hotel gave his parents a space to raise a damn nice kid who made something of himself.

Re: US Citizens Will Need Visa to Travel to Europe in 2024

#59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't beat around the bush. Who is keeping who out of schengen?

Netherlands and Austria are keeping Romania and Bulgaria out of Schengen even though Romania (at least) meets the necessary requirements to join for the last few years.

Much better thank you Aziz.

Re: US Citizens Will Need Visa to Travel to Europe in 2024

#60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many Indians also want to visit the EU/US for short days and tourism, or for other very valid and legitimate reasons. These can be with a long history of not breaking visa norms of other countries, and yet face delays of 2+ years. It's not that these delays cannot be reduced; there's just no will to do that. It makes my blood boil that I have to endure a disproportionate burden of proof on myself: - demonstrate good…

as a US citizen, I'll give you the straight truth. it comes down to racism. indians come in and pretty much dominate wherever they go. most hotels and gas stations (and hospitals and pharmaceuticals) are indian/Chinese dominated industries and the whites need some level of protectionism to compete.

If this were remotely the case one would expect Americans to be the ones clamoring to get to India
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