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Remote Work to Wipe Out $800B from Office Values, McKinsey Says

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Re: Remote Work to Wipe Out $800B from Office Values, McKinsey Says

#151
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the weirdest conspiracy theory that HN has gotten obsessed with of late.

I don't know if it's wise to place such a challenge in front of all of us.

HN seems to have avoided "microchips in vaccines" and "UFOs are alien aircraft" for the most part. But "return to office is a secret plot to prop up commercial real estate" gets almost zero pushback.

Re: Remote Work to Wipe Out $800B from Office Values, McKinsey Says

#152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the weirdest conspiracy theory that HN has gotten obsessed with of late.

What's the 'conspiracy'? It's out in the open. >New Jersey and Texas are states that stand out for spelling out exactly how often employees must work from the office to qualify for tax breaks. Before the pandemic, several New Jersey tax programs required workers to show up at least 80% of the time, and one Texas program set the threshold at 50%. >Miami, which has seen an influx of new businesses throughout the pandem…

Tax breaks for businesses are not a secret plot by the illuminati to prop up their side-investments in commercial real estate. Please read what you're actually linking to and replying to.

Re: Remote Work to Wipe Out $800B from Office Values, McKinsey Says

#154
post #114
post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't even turn my video on these days during calls. Most of my team mates don't. Some of them don't know how I look and I don't know how some of them look. And yet, we work well as a team. We are all in different cities and countries and work remote. Unless our physical presence is necessary (hairstylist, nurse, chef...), we should aggressively push back on "come to office 300 days a year" requirement. Only dumb m…

This is fine for experienced workers who already know the job, but for anyone who is new (say first 2-5 years) or is looking for mentoring and growth/advancement opportunities, then the lack of in-person connections does hurt. > Those who claim they build friendships etc at work, maybe genuinely ask yourselves - how many colleagues from your previous jobs do you really keep in touch? I'll speak for myself and say tha…

I've a team member who is about a year out of college. He calls me 2-3 times a week asking for help on whatever task he is working on. His timezone is 10 hours ahead of mine. Mentoring is doable. Couple of months ago, there were some discussions on restricting remote work (thankfully it didn't go anywhere, at least not yet). He was distraught, as his commute was at least 90 minutes, one way.

Obviously nothing beats face-to-face interactions. But we need to consider the cost of it too. 3 hours of commute a day? Paying for gas, childcare? Polluting the environment, clogging the roads?

We can try to solve these problems with better infrastructure (like highspeed rails), banning corporations like BlackRock buying up large chunks of desirable neighborhoods/holding them hostage etc. That would require some serious effort and willpower, which seem hard to come by.

As for relationships, I too have a handful of people from years ago that I keep in touch. This can certainly be a disadvantage with remote work, but we need to compromise somewhere...

Re: Remote Work to Wipe Out $800B from Office Values, McKinsey Says

#155
post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My former employer (in London) has just instructed everyone, finally after COVID, to be in the office for 50% of the time. Many of my former colleagues starting looking for other jobs last week. It seems employers have two concerns: cost and presenteeism. The first is easily solved, downsize your office. The second, is an organisational problem. Why commute for 90 minutes each way to sit in a office with headphones o…

> It seems employers have two concerns: cost and presenteeism. There's real value in people talking to their coworkers in person and knowing them. There's an obvious cost as well, but let's not pretend there's no value there.

> There's real value in people talking to their coworkers in person and knowing them.

There can also be real toxicity. From intimidation to harassment in-person interactions can be enabling.

In addition, in person interaction favors the person who speaks confidently and quickly over those who may be of the type that ponders more. Often in inperson interactions those feedbacks can be drowned out whereas a more collaborative document oriented interaction may bring that kind of feedback out.

Re: Remote Work to Wipe Out $800B from Office Values, McKinsey Says

#156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a public discussion forum, not your living room.

I don't know what this is supposed to mean. Do you think a company is asking someone to come in to the office because they're worried about their landlord's property values?

You changed your comment from this short text:

> No one is asking you.

Quite dishonest to act confused.

Re: Remote Work to Wipe Out $800B from Office Values, McKinsey Says

#158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, you can't be anything blue-collar remotely. As well as jobs like healthcare. Lots of jobs still require you to physically interact with people or things.

All of those jobs should pay MUCH more.

why should they though? They pay what the market will bear. They could pay a bit more if they would unionize successfully. Also lots of them do pay more when people take a risk and enter specialties and openly look for opportunity. You aren't going to make 100k digging ditches, but you can easily make that much as a plumber or electrician or machining expert.

Re: Remote Work to Wipe Out $800B from Office Values, McKinsey Says

#159
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The world will never stop, not even for humans. On the other hand, if you have built a career around commercial office real-estate, the world might just have stopped for you. Still, live goes on.

Sure you have to feel sorry for realtors to some extent. But real-estate is at the very heart of the financial system, and therefore the economy if not the government. So this is not about individual careers or working preferences in themselves.

There are plenty people who are making money in real estate in other market though, why is office space special? No one cared when my Great-great grandpa Willy the wagon wheel maker lost his job because of cars.

Re: Remote Work to Wipe Out $800B from Office Values, McKinsey Says

#160
post #57

I refuse to be miserable in an office just for someone else's building value.

My former employer (in London) has just instructed everyone, finally after COVID, to be in the office for 50% of the time. Many of my former colleagues starting looking for other jobs last week. It seems employers have two concerns: cost and presenteeism. The first is easily solved, downsize your office. The second, is an organisational problem. Why commute for 90 minutes each way to sit in a office with headphones o…

Humans are infinitely adaptable, I believe that most of the wailing and gnashing of teeth is purely psychological need for middle managers to lord over people in their office fiefdoms. My productivity has never been better not having to commute and listen to infinite office gossip and random phone calls while in my cube. It could be a personal failing that I'm easily distracted but it is what it is. I work better from home and will continue to seek out those opportunities over driving an hour to and from work. Consider it my contribution to the lower CO2 effort.
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