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Remote Work to Wipe Out $800B from Office Values, McKinsey Says

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Re: Remote Work to Wipe Out $800B from Office Values, McKinsey Says

#81

Post by jnwatson »

claytonjy wrote: post #70
anotherthrway wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Luxury conversions - 2 apts max per floor? — could address the single shared utility risers/core of the typical office building. Schematically: [ a | util | b ]. Malls are also on the table for conversions these days. That is a much simpler transformation.

Why are malls simpler to transform? All the malls I'm familiar with have relatively few bathrooms per floor, and huge interiors (low wall:floor ratio) that would seem hard to slice up into apartments.

It is far easier to add plumbing to the ground floor of a building. In fact everything is easier if you’re not 1000 feet in the air.

Re: Remote Work to Wipe Out $800B from Office Values, McKinsey Says

#82

Post by mycall »

hotpotamus wrote: post #66
WirelessGigabit wrote: post #2

I refuse to be miserable in an office just for someone else's building value.

Most of my experience of employment has been enduring misery in order to create value for someone else. It's pretty hard to escape.

Creating order out of chaos. That is all a job really does.

Re: Remote Work to Wipe Out $800B from Office Values, McKinsey Says

#83

Post by hdjjhhvvhga »

tshaddox wrote: post #61
WirelessGigabit wrote: post #2

I refuse to be miserable in an office just for someone else's building value.

The argument, as always, will be that the real estate market is using all of society as human shields and thus must be bailed out or otherwise protected from financial loss.

But actually these are two markets: commercial real estate and the residential one. While you could have some (weak IMO) arguments in favor of the latter, it is the former that is undergoing changes and I see no reasons for taxpayers to bail anybody involved.

Re: Remote Work to Wipe Out $800B from Office Values, McKinsey Says

#84

Post by mycall »

jacknews wrote: post #28
CyberDildonics wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If a company wants someone to come back to the office, it isn't for their landlord's property value. If they have lots of free space they can sublease it out, it doesn't make any sense to force people in to an office just to burn money and miss out on revenue.

It's quite embarrassing to be paying the lease on an empty office though. But I suspect this groupthink is not originating from individual companies.

Even for businesses that own buildings but are losing money, they can't sell their building in this market. So, they expect you to use it even though they would rather sell the building for the cash flow.

Re: Remote Work to Wipe Out $800B from Office Values, McKinsey Says

#85

Post by benjaminwootton »

londons_explore wrote: post #16

What amazes me is that we didn't see a faster cratering in value in office space. On any given day in any capital city, perhaps 50% of office desks sit empty. Yet I can't buy an office building for cents on the dollar. Normally when supply far exceeds demand like this, companies owning those assets can't pay their bills, the building is sold, there are no buyers, auction prices crash, the crashing prices cause more c…

I was about to comment on London then saw it in your username.

The City and Canary Wharf still feel like ghost towns compared to how they used to be, especially Mondays and Fridays.

I work in various WeWork offices when I’m in town and they seem 80% empty, and I think they’ve relatively done well.

I don’t understand how it makes sense to keep these offices open.

Re: Remote Work to Wipe Out $800B from Office Values, McKinsey Says

#86

Post by hdjjhhvvhga »

jacknews wrote: post #28
CyberDildonics wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If a company wants someone to come back to the office, it isn't for their landlord's property value. If they have lots of free space they can sublease it out, it doesn't make any sense to force people in to an office just to burn money and miss out on revenue.

It's quite embarrassing to be paying the lease on an empty office though. But I suspect this groupthink is not originating from individual companies.

> It's quite embarrassing to be paying the lease on an empty office though.

While I agree, and I can imagine CEOs/CFOs in a hard spot over a 10-year lease with an empty office, what is better: to just pay what you had promised if downsizing is not possible, or pay and have disgruntled employees, with most of them immediately starting to look for another job and leaving as soon as they manage to find it?

Re: Remote Work to Wipe Out $800B from Office Values, McKinsey Says

#87

Post by mycall »

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #50

We've become more efficient as a society. We stopped wasting fuel, our time and wear and tear on cars. All that time and material can be spent on something productive. Instead headlines tell about value of offices. Maybe that value was not real. It only existed because someone with power over employees could force them to waste resources. It's a market failure.

What are some examples of something more productive? Hobbies and family time?

Re: Remote Work to Wipe Out $800B from Office Values, McKinsey Says

#88

Post by inglor_cz »

otachack wrote: post #17

Costs will be appended to the workers. I hope we all realize someday how working from home applies further wear & tear to our amenities and homes compared to the office's. Think toilets, sinks, fridges, chairs, doors, floors, etc. I fully advocate for WFH regardless and to even supplement with an option like DeskPass for those that want to take a break from home. But a portion of those former office costs should go t…

IDK about how much wear and tear I inflict on my doors and floors by programming from home.

You would have a better point by arguing about energy consumption, there the difference might actually be significant. If you, e.g., need to run your air conditioning in hot summer.

Re: Remote Work to Wipe Out $800B from Office Values, McKinsey Says

#89

Post by kevin_thibedeau »

heyoni wrote: post #72
bipop5000 wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think most older buildings are able to be converted, but not the new types of commercial buildings.

Why? Does no one like floor to ceiling windows anymore? I’m sorry if I sound sarcastic, it’s a real question. I kind of love the way some offices look on the outside.

Large floor plates make it difficult to fit in smaller, affordable apartments with their own windows and full utilization of the interior. The rich already have their dedicated aeries so they don't need to live in a conversion to find large spaces.

Re: Remote Work to Wipe Out $800B from Office Values, McKinsey Says

#90

Post by pxue »

convolvatron wrote: post #80
pxue wrote: post #75

[flagged]

Yes. However no one ever seems to show up with any counter arguments. Some people here miss going in.

At least here in Toronto (linked article is Bloomberg Canada), banks (minus tech department) are back to office 5 days a week. I just feel like outside of tech, wfh isn't much of a debate.
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