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Study finds billions of nanoplastics released when microwaving containers

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Re: Study finds billions of nanoplastics released when microwaving containers

#81

Post by Ekaros »

NovaDudely wrote: post #49
productizeme93 wrote: post #2

It's surprising to me how much we don't understand about plastic still. Years ago I was in a kitchen shop with an out of town friend and we saw some Sous Vide equipment. I told her that we had one and that you could either plastic bags or vacuum sealed bags to cook in the water. Her reaction was an immediate "absolutely not." That's when I realized that she worked in a lab that focused on plastics. Her big call out w…

The more chemists I have spoken to over the years, the more I hear warnings about polymers in general. Seems as though, that in general structure simply cannot be manufactured in a way that is innocuous to our health. It is plausible that plastic will be the next tobacco/leaded gasoline. Time will tell however.

I have wondered about carbon steel and cast iron for cooking. The common method is to "season" them for use. But that is done with fats and high heat? What is the stuff that forms? Is it also some type of polymer? It doesn't seem to survive acidic environment too well. So acids could break it down, is it actually safe to eat? Or something comparable to plastics?

Re: Study finds billions of nanoplastics released when microwaving containers

#82

Post by earthbee »

parentheses wrote: post #62
Aurornis wrote: post #35

> Rather than introduce just the number of particles released by one container, the researchers instead exposed the cells to particle concentrations that infants and toddlers might accumulate over days or from multiple sources. > After two days, just 23% of kidney cells exposed to the highest concentrations had managed to survive So they used concentrations that they believe toddlers might accumulate over two days an…

The article is only presenting that: 1. nano/microplastics kill kidney cells in a lab environment 2. nano/microplastics come from microwaving containers Regardless of whether you agree with the conclusion _you_ are drawing from reading the article, the article is saying those things. In order to make a real-world-ish experiment, we'd have to start experimenting on children. I feel that while you're expressing outrage…

I don't think anything Auronis was expressing outrage, nothing they wrote even hints at it to me. They just seem to be expressing a line of reasoning.

Re: Study finds billions of nanoplastics released when microwaving containers

#83

Post by drones »

Aurornis wrote: post #35

> Rather than introduce just the number of particles released by one container, the researchers instead exposed the cells to particle concentrations that infants and toddlers might accumulate over days or from multiple sources. > After two days, just 23% of kidney cells exposed to the highest concentrations had managed to survive So they used concentrations that they believe toddlers might accumulate over two days an…

Generally speaking I don't take lab results seriously until I see tests in real world environments. Deployment always presents new challenges after development.

Not trying to be dismissive, but statements like that reminds me of "Miracle Drug Ivermectin[0]/Industrial Bleach[1] Cures Covid After XX Hours"

[0] https://www.monash.edu/discovery-institute/news-and-events/n... [1] https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/coronavi...

Re: Study finds billions of nanoplastics released when microwaving containers

#84

Post by ChatGTP »

bee_rider wrote: post #65
dataflow wrote: post #14

As someone who avoids cooking with plastic, I've always wondered... what makes people think it's safe? Does it not occur to most people that plastics can break down through the heat they're subjected to, or do they assume the plastics in question have been specifically designed to adequately withstand that?

Yeah, there’s just something too suspicious about heated plastics. I feel the same way about those Teflon pans as well. I don’t have any evidence, I just… don’t trust ‘em.

I think intuition is underrated too.

Re: Study finds billions of nanoplastics released when microwaving containers

#85

Post by toweriewrwer »

parentheses wrote: post #62
Aurornis wrote: post #35

> Rather than introduce just the number of particles released by one container, the researchers instead exposed the cells to particle concentrations that infants and toddlers might accumulate over days or from multiple sources. > After two days, just 23% of kidney cells exposed to the highest concentrations had managed to survive So they used concentrations that they believe toddlers might accumulate over two days an…

The article is only presenting that: 1. nano/microplastics kill kidney cells in a lab environment 2. nano/microplastics come from microwaving containers Regardless of whether you agree with the conclusion _you_ are drawing from reading the article, the article is saying those things. In order to make a real-world-ish experiment, we'd have to start experimenting on children. I feel that while you're expressing outrage…

[flagged]

Re: Study finds billions of nanoplastics released when microwaving containers

#86

Post by mschuster91 »

dopa42365 wrote: post #79

Microwave ovens have been everywhere for 70 years already. If gazillions femtoplastics killed toddlers left and right, that'd be kinda hard to miss hmmyes?

We are seeing suspicious changes across populations though in that timeframe... earlier onset of puberty for example, lower fertility as a whole and higher rates of infertility due to poor sperm quality, obesity rates, cancer rates and others.

Of course there is no single cause behind this, and many have been suggested - microplastics, hormonal agents in plastics, more food, higher amounts of processed food, overusage of medication. It may even be the cause that progress from other unrelated changes (like the lead bans) "mask" bad effects getting worse.

The problem is, some of the effects take decades to show up in general population, and because microplastics are everywhere on the planet there isn't even a control group any more.

Re: Study finds billions of nanoplastics released when microwaving containers

#87

Post by staunton »

andersrs wrote: post #71
pkdpic wrote: post #3

> Experiments have shown that microwaving plastic baby food containers available on the shelves of U.S. stores can release huge numbers of plastic particles — in some cases, more than 2 billion nanoplastics and 4 million microplastics for every square centimeter of container. > After two days, just 23% of kidney cells exposed to the highest concentrations had managed to survive — a much higher mortality rate than tha…

1. Every few years we find a new chemical like BPA is bad for us. The companies just made a meme called 'BPA free' and continue making slightly different crap. Goto 1. I still see microwave popcorn bags, teflon pans and plastic tea bags in shops. The local municipality still pretend that it's all being recycled. It needs to be phased out of food industry leaded fuel as phased out of gas.

There's still no replacement (must be at least as cheap), so it will keep going for quite a while. Maybe plant or mushroom fibers can eventually take over some of the market.

Re: Study finds billions of nanoplastics released when microwaving containers

#88

Post by pbhjpbhj »

userbinator wrote: post #44
productizeme93 wrote: post #2

It's surprising to me how much we don't understand about plastic still. Years ago I was in a kitchen shop with an out of town friend and we saw some Sous Vide equipment. I told her that we had one and that you could either plastic bags or vacuum sealed bags to cook in the water. Her reaction was an immediate "absolutely not." That's when I realized that she worked in a lab that focused on plastics. Her big call out w…

What exactly were those studies on? Those bags are almost certainly polyethyelene without any additives, which is safe and has been in widespread use for almost a century. Petroleum jelly is far more reactive than PE, although it's substantially the same chemical structure, yet most of us regularly use it on our skin. If the biggest concern about sous vide is the plastic, then I think that's a very strong argument fo…

>Petroleum jelly [...] most of us regularly use it on our skin.

I think I've used it maybe a handful of times in my whole life; once a year at the very most. Do you mind expanding on your statement here?

Re: Study finds billions of nanoplastics released when microwaving containers

#89

Post by joecool1029 »

I just want to read the paper, can someone with a institution access liberate it?

I commented about a month ago in a related thread and would like to know if the study measured a thought I had: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36534508

To reiterate, is there a difference between adding boiling or near boiling water or other liquid from a kettle to a plastic container vs putting a container full of water in microwave oven? Is there local heating that happens in the plastic that causes it to shed more than just heated water alone?

Re: Study finds billions of nanoplastics released when microwaving containers

#90

Post by nashashmi »

Avoid excess microwaving plastic containers. And don't keep old plastic wares for too long. Change them periodically (annual for permanent wares, 2 months for disposable wares).

I only microwave 30 sec, frown on microwaving more than a minute. My wife microwaves for 2 minutes or more! The latter is a problem because I know (some of) the food gets unevenly hot (while the other parts are still cold) that it melts the plastic.

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