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Richard Rhodes wrote a classic book about Oppenheimer and the atomic bomb

theatlantic.com

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Re: Richard Rhodes wrote a classic book about Oppenheimer and the atomic bomb

#21

Post by superkuh »

mcpackieh wrote: post #17
superkuh wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am actually re-reading it right now (started 6 months ago). No, it doesn't cover that ~1924 event. But it's an excellent book. Ignoring it because it doesn't go into all the people's childhoods seems like an over-reaction. Just to be clear, "The Making of the Atomic Bomb" is about the lead up to and the making of the atomic bomb. It is not about Oppenheimer though it does go into great detail about all the major pl…

> childhoods 20 year olds shouldn't be considered culpable for attempted murder now? Madness. This is an important biographical detail not only because attempted murder is always relevant, but also because it is relevant to his involvement in an idea to poison Germany's food supply with radioactive strontium. Edit for correction: it happened in 1926, he was 22 years old.

Yes. The person whom the alleged noxious apple was left for was his tutor. Children have tutors. Adults far more rarely.

Re: Richard Rhodes wrote a classic book about Oppenheimer and the atomic bomb

#22

Post by [deleted] »

superkuh wrote: post #21
mcpackieh wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> childhoods 20 year olds shouldn't be considered culpable for attempted murder now? Madness. This is an important biographical detail not only because attempted murder is always relevant, but also because it is relevant to his involvement in an idea to poison Germany's food supply with radioactive strontium. Edit for correction: it happened in 1926, he was 22 years old.

Yes. The person whom the alleged noxious apple was left for was his tutor. Children have tutors. Adults far more rarely.

[deleted]

Re: Richard Rhodes wrote a classic book about Oppenheimer and the atomic bomb

#23

Post by twoodfin »

masfuerte wrote: post #18
mcpackieh wrote: post #9

Does anybody know if this book (or the movie) covers Oppenheimers attempt to murder his teacher with a cyanide laced apple? I don't care to invest time in a biography that whitewashes the man.

The Times review says this attempted murder is Oppenheimer's first significant act in the film.

Spoilers!

Re: Richard Rhodes wrote a classic book about Oppenheimer and the atomic bomb

#24

Post by mcpackieh »

superkuh wrote: post #21
mcpackieh wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> childhoods 20 year olds shouldn't be considered culpable for attempted murder now? Madness. This is an important biographical detail not only because attempted murder is always relevant, but also because it is relevant to his involvement in an idea to poison Germany's food supply with radioactive strontium. Edit for correction: it happened in 1926, he was 22 years old.

Yes. The person whom the alleged noxious apple was left for was his tutor. Children have tutors. Adults far more rarely.

He was *22 years old, at Cambridge. He should have been expelled for it (not to mention criminally charged) but his father was wealthy so normal rules didn't apply.

Re: Richard Rhodes wrote a classic book about Oppenheimer and the atomic bomb

#25

Post by twoodfin »

mcpackieh wrote: post #9

Does anybody know if this book (or the movie) covers Oppenheimers attempt to murder his teacher with a cyanide laced apple? I don't care to invest time in a biography that whitewashes the man.

American Prometheus (the book on which the film is primarily based) covers the event in detail.

Re: Richard Rhodes wrote a classic book about Oppenheimer and the atomic bomb

#26

Post by mcpackieh »

masfuerte wrote: post #18
mcpackieh wrote: post #9

Does anybody know if this book (or the movie) covers Oppenheimers attempt to murder his teacher with a cyanide laced apple? I don't care to invest time in a biography that whitewashes the man.

The Times review says this attempted murder is Oppenheimer's first significant act in the film.

Good, thank you.

Re: Richard Rhodes wrote a classic book about Oppenheimer and the atomic bomb

#27

Post by cyberax »

philipkglass wrote: post #19
sklargh wrote: post #6

I recommend Rhodes’ “Making of” and Dark Sun with American Prometheus and the Los Alamos Primer for people seeking a thorough initial introduction to the Manhattan Project and little bit of postscript. Indulging myself a bit here. Essentially all elements of modern society have at least a tangential relationship with Los Alamos. The symmetry between a nuclear detonation and what happened intellectually and culturally…

Rhodes' The Making of the Atomic Bomb is deservedly regarded as a classic, but Dark Sun doesn't live up to the same standard [1]. For people interested in the technical history of the H-bomb, Anne Fitzpatrick's PhD thesis Igniting the Light Elements: The Los Alamos Thermonuclear Weapon Project, 1942-1952 is as good a single-document source as I've ever read: https://www.osti.gov/biblio/10596 [1] Some reasons for the…

"The Making" covers half a century of scientific advancement, from the age of steam to the nuclear weapons. And it was at the end the "heroic age" in physics. It's hard _not_ to make it read like an epic tale.

"Dark Sun" is in contrast about a fairly small technological advancement, and it focuses more on politics. It's just too hard to make it similarly compelling.

Re: Richard Rhodes wrote a classic book about Oppenheimer and the atomic bomb

#28

Post by adonovan »

mistrial9 wrote: post #15
sklargh wrote: post #6

I recommend Rhodes’ “Making of” and Dark Sun with American Prometheus and the Los Alamos Primer for people seeking a thorough initial introduction to the Manhattan Project and little bit of postscript. Indulging myself a bit here. Essentially all elements of modern society have at least a tangential relationship with Los Alamos. The symmetry between a nuclear detonation and what happened intellectually and culturally…

that's very grandiose and all, but this story is true. During the Fukishima aftermath here in the USA, a series of talks was called at UC Berkeley with the public invited. One of the talks was given by an actual nuclear weapons designer, who rarely stands in public for obvious reasons. A large, confident bearded man, he "commanded" the podium with ever more tales, speaking like that paragraph above.. Someone challeng…

Priceless. Thanks for sharing.

Re: Richard Rhodes wrote a classic book about Oppenheimer and the atomic bomb

#29

Post by vunderba »

mcpackieh wrote: post #9

Does anybody know if this book (or the movie) covers Oppenheimers attempt to murder his teacher with a cyanide laced apple? I don't care to invest time in a biography that whitewashes the man.

From the Science History Institute: "Fergusson was right to worry. Like all Cambridge students, Oppenheimer had an official tutor. This was an older graduate student who acted like a mentor. His tutor’s name was Patrick Blackett. Blackett was robust, popular, and good with his hands—everything Oppenheimer wasn’t. Oppenheimer developed a seething hatred for him.

Things came to a head in 1926 when Oppenheimer put a poisoned apple on Blackett’s desk, then left to vacation in Corsica.

Thankfully, Blackett never ate the apple. But Oppenheimer’s Corsica companions spilled the beans, and when Cambridge University found out, the administrators decided to press charges of attempted murder. And they would have. Except, Oppenheimer’s rich father happened to be visiting that week. He begged Cambridge to spare his precious, genius son. So, Oppenheimer got off with mere probation."

https://www.sciencehistory.org/stories/disappearing-pod/the-...

I'd always read that he was somewhat troubled, but this guy was a borderline psychopath.

Re: Richard Rhodes wrote a classic book about Oppenheimer and the atomic bomb

#30

Post by adonovan »

opwieurposiu wrote: post #5

The thing that struck me from this book (or maybe it was in "Dark Sun") was how much the soviets were spying. We were giving them detailed plans for chemical factories, tire factories, engines, alloys, anything you can think of. They did not trust us so they would spy on all this stuff anyway. They would fill up a C-47 Skytrains(lend-lease) with stolen documents and fly them out to Moscow through Alaska. I have to gi…

Ya, that was the most memorable part of Dark Sun. IIRC the State department confronted the Soviet ambassador about the routine exfiltration of boxes and boxes of US R&D documents, and the response was something like "We're losing 10,000 people a day in this war. This is how you be our ally.".
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