Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Richard Rhodes wrote a classic book about Oppenheimer and the atomic bomb

theatlantic.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

11–20 of 80 posts

Re: Richard Rhodes wrote a classic book about Oppenheimer and the atomic bomb

#11

Post by InTheArena »

opwieurposiu wrote: post #5

The thing that struck me from this book (or maybe it was in "Dark Sun") was how much the soviets were spying. We were giving them detailed plans for chemical factories, tire factories, engines, alloys, anything you can think of. They did not trust us so they would spy on all this stuff anyway. They would fill up a C-47 Skytrains(lend-lease) with stolen documents and fly them out to Moscow through Alaska. I have to gi…

This. It gets far worse the further you get - it wasn't just spying. Sean McMeekan's recent book details how pervasive it was - for example, Harry Dexter White was in the Department of treasury, helped write the Morgenthau plan, which extended the war, and assigned "the booty" of germany to the soviets and leaked it to the soviets and the press. That led to "a near-miraculous revitalization of the German army."

The soviets under Stalin played the allies _hard_ during World War 2.

Re: Richard Rhodes wrote a classic book about Oppenheimer and the atomic bomb

#12

Post by kabdib »

sklargh wrote: post #6

I recommend Rhodes’ “Making of” and Dark Sun with American Prometheus and the Los Alamos Primer for people seeking a thorough initial introduction to the Manhattan Project and little bit of postscript. Indulging myself a bit here. Essentially all elements of modern society have at least a tangential relationship with Los Alamos. The symmetry between a nuclear detonation and what happened intellectually and culturally…

Eric Schlosser's Command and Control is a nice historical view of the nuclear defense establishment, and describes a particularly terrible missile site failure.

Re: Richard Rhodes wrote a classic book about Oppenheimer and the atomic bomb

#14

Post by amelius »

philomath_mn wrote: post #10
opwieurposiu wrote: post #5

The thing that struck me from this book (or maybe it was in "Dark Sun") was how much the soviets were spying. We were giving them detailed plans for chemical factories, tire factories, engines, alloys, anything you can think of. They did not trust us so they would spy on all this stuff anyway. They would fill up a C-47 Skytrains(lend-lease) with stolen documents and fly them out to Moscow through Alaska. I have to gi…

Well, to be fair, spying on a free and open society is much easier than spying on the opposite.

There's a parallel here with

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance

Re: Richard Rhodes wrote a classic book about Oppenheimer and the atomic bomb

#15

Post by mistrial9 »

sklargh wrote: post #6

I recommend Rhodes’ “Making of” and Dark Sun with American Prometheus and the Los Alamos Primer for people seeking a thorough initial introduction to the Manhattan Project and little bit of postscript. Indulging myself a bit here. Essentially all elements of modern society have at least a tangential relationship with Los Alamos. The symmetry between a nuclear detonation and what happened intellectually and culturally…

that's very grandiose and all, but this story is true. During the Fukishima aftermath here in the USA, a series of talks was called at UC Berkeley with the public invited. One of the talks was given by an actual nuclear weapons designer, who rarely stands in public for obvious reasons. A large, confident bearded man, he "commanded" the podium with ever more tales, speaking like that paragraph above.. Someone challenged him in some polite and meaningful way in a question, and just as he was starting to reply, people were getting uncomfortable due to the excessive air conditioning in the room -- it was hot outside but apparently the air conditioner was ON with a sensor not in the room? Someone went to check on the air conditioning exactly when the guy said "The USA has NEVER FAILED to achieve a stated objective in nuclear deterrance" or something similar, when the guy from the audience checking the thermostat said helplessly "its stuck ON, there is nothing I can do!"

it was so appropriate, had to repeat that here.. true.. and what a WEIRD collection of humanity were in the audience. Those old physics people and their kin, plus paranoids and vegans.. the lot.

Re: Richard Rhodes wrote a classic book about Oppenheimer and the atomic bomb

#16

Post by superkuh »

mcpackieh wrote: post #9

Does anybody know if this book (or the movie) covers Oppenheimers attempt to murder his teacher with a cyanide laced apple? I don't care to invest time in a biography that whitewashes the man.

I am actually re-reading it right now (started 6 months ago). No, it doesn't cover that ~1924 event. But it's an excellent book. Ignoring it because it doesn't go into all the people's childhoods seems like an over-reaction.

Just to be clear, "The Making of the Atomic Bomb" is about the lead up to and the making of the atomic bomb. It is not about Oppenheimer though it does go into great detail about all the major players.

Re: Richard Rhodes wrote a classic book about Oppenheimer and the atomic bomb

#17

Post by mcpackieh »

superkuh wrote: post #16
mcpackieh wrote: post #9

Does anybody know if this book (or the movie) covers Oppenheimers attempt to murder his teacher with a cyanide laced apple? I don't care to invest time in a biography that whitewashes the man.

I am actually re-reading it right now (started 6 months ago). No, it doesn't cover that ~1924 event. But it's an excellent book. Ignoring it because it doesn't go into all the people's childhoods seems like an over-reaction. Just to be clear, "The Making of the Atomic Bomb" is about the lead up to and the making of the atomic bomb. It is not about Oppenheimer though it does go into great detail about all the major pl…

> childhoods

20 year olds shouldn't be considered culpable for attempted murder now? Madness.

This is an important biographical detail not only because attempted murder is always relevant, but also because it is relevant to his involvement in an idea to poison Germany's food supply with radioactive strontium.

Edit for correction: it happened in 1926, he was 22 years old.

Re: Richard Rhodes wrote a classic book about Oppenheimer and the atomic bomb

#18

Post by masfuerte »

mcpackieh wrote: post #9

Does anybody know if this book (or the movie) covers Oppenheimers attempt to murder his teacher with a cyanide laced apple? I don't care to invest time in a biography that whitewashes the man.

The Times review says this attempted murder is Oppenheimer's first significant act in the film.

Re: Richard Rhodes wrote a classic book about Oppenheimer and the atomic bomb

#19

Post by philipkglass »

sklargh wrote: post #6

I recommend Rhodes’ “Making of” and Dark Sun with American Prometheus and the Los Alamos Primer for people seeking a thorough initial introduction to the Manhattan Project and little bit of postscript. Indulging myself a bit here. Essentially all elements of modern society have at least a tangential relationship with Los Alamos. The symmetry between a nuclear detonation and what happened intellectually and culturally…

Rhodes' The Making of the Atomic Bomb is deservedly regarded as a classic, but Dark Sun doesn't live up to the same standard [1]. For people interested in the technical history of the H-bomb, Anne Fitzpatrick's PhD thesis Igniting the Light Elements: The Los Alamos Thermonuclear Weapon Project, 1942-1952 is as good a single-document source as I've ever read:

https://www.osti.gov/biblio/10596

[1] Some reasons for the difference discussed here: https://old.reddit.com/r/nuclearweapons/comments/wr2pav/why_...

Re: Richard Rhodes wrote a classic book about Oppenheimer and the atomic bomb

#20

Post by sklargh »

kabdib wrote: post #12
sklargh wrote: post #6

I recommend Rhodes’ “Making of” and Dark Sun with American Prometheus and the Los Alamos Primer for people seeking a thorough initial introduction to the Manhattan Project and little bit of postscript. Indulging myself a bit here. Essentially all elements of modern society have at least a tangential relationship with Los Alamos. The symmetry between a nuclear detonation and what happened intellectually and culturally…

Eric Schlosser's Command and Control is a nice historical view of the nuclear defense establishment, and describes a particularly terrible missile site failure.

Yeah for those who wish to go deeper Stumpf’s Minuteman and Titan histories are good resources as well. There is also the Effects of Nuclear Weapons.
Post reply on HN