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New laws trying to criminalize filming cops

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Re: New laws trying to criminalize filming cops

#231

Post by Clubber »

mywittyname wrote: post #132
mitt_romney_12 wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Most people respect and want cops 89% of Americans think that changes need to made to make policing better and 50% of Americans think that major changes need to be made [1]. > People whining about cops being mean to them, and their general dispositions, tends to think that their police interaction is a super special customer service experience and that the system is faulty when it falls short of their expectations.…

Believable metric. Many citizens in the abstract, "support" police. But police are pretty indiscriminate with their power tripping. So people with actual experience dealing with them tend to form negative opinions when they realize this might be a Leopard Ate Your Face moment. I've heard an actual person say, "I though police were only like that to people".

An old saying I heard was, "Everyone is a liberal until they are mugged. Everyone is a conservative until they are harassed by the police."

>I've heard an actual person say, "I though police were only like that to people".

I saw a video of a lady getting a ticket for something and kept saying, "But I'm a Republican!" As if that would make the officer change his mind.

Re: New laws trying to criminalize filming cops

#232

Post by costanzaDynasty »

542354234235 wrote: post #203
costanzaDynasty wrote: post #80

I've always thought hate crime laws are so misguided. It's just another law to use against people you don't like. Piling on charges for no other reason other than making you feel good. Do you like the perp? No: Hate crime Yes: The brain isn't fully formed yet I worked on the low end of a giant corporation and they would always add new rules, seemingly targeting people they we trying to fire. Stupid rules like you can…

Crimes are often differentiated based on the perpetrators motivation, thought process, and reasoning. They do this for two reasons; the severity of the crime can be informed by them and the likelihood of recidivism and path to rehabilitation. Take first degree and second degree murder. Both are the intentional taking of someone’s life, but are differentiated based of intent. Someone that decides to murder their spous…

Yup, that's a hate crime description. And depending on what state or the ripple of pop culture and social media, lies the inequality.

But really what it is, another tax law onto the rats nest.

You have more than enough laws to render reasonable justice. The people that hate crime laws try to protect would be served with better lawyers to advocate for the people caught between and around the criminal justice system.

Re: New laws trying to criminalize filming cops

#233

Post by hellojesus »

watwut wrote: post #153
dcow wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You might be surprised how much a group of armed citizens can do against a police squad. I don't think “you’ll never protect yourself from the gov’t” is an accurate angle.

They can't do nothing and if they try, they will go to prison forever.

In the short term, any resistance is a death sentence. However, the gov agents always have to think about whether the person they're encountering is willing to throw their life away. If enough citizens become willing to be dead, real change happens. Sacrifice is required for such events, but clearly having an armed population helps reduce the power asymmetry.

Re: New laws trying to criminalize filming cops

#234

Post by test098 »

Supermancho wrote: post #103
ceejayoz wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The ones who pay the most are LE. This is simply not true. Cops die via gunfire in sub-100 numbers annually. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_law_enforcement_office...

I meant pay for the right to bear arms in being exposed to the consequences. Might want to look at gunfire injuries that are not deaths. There is also the issue of how this happens despite training, their own weapons, armor, etc that are daily requirements. The general populace would probably see better survival rates with these things as well, right? It's more than a little biased to just point at deaths.

> I meant pay for the right to bear arms in being exposed to the consequences.

uh no, school-age children (including elementary school children) are the ones who pay the most for our gun-happy culture.

Re: New laws trying to criminalize filming cops

#235

Post by test098 »

rascul wrote: post #202
mitt_romney_12 wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A gun isn't going to protect you from police violence, it's just going to give them a reason to become even more militarized and an excuse after they shoot you

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bundy_standoff

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Philando_Castile

Re: New laws trying to criminalize filming cops

#236

Post by hellojesus »

mitt_romney_12 wrote: post #58
lordfrito wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But they are so fragile that a smirk can intimidate them? First let me say I'm not on the side of these kinds of laws. We can't be passing laws giving special privileges to (or removing privileges from) a particular group of people. "Our constitution is color-blind, and neither knows nor tolerates classes among citizens. In respect of civil rights, all citizens are equal before the law." Plessy v. Ferguson (1896) […

> Why wouldn't police officers be subject to the same kinds of protections from microagressions afforded to others? These are special protections afforded only to police officers. Normal people are protected from hate speech about their race or gender but cops are protected from "hate speech" about their race, gender, or profession . It's not hate speech to say "Fuck Lawyers" but it is to say "Fuck the Police".

> Normal people are protected from hate speech about their race or gender but cops are protected from "hate speech" about their race, gender, or profession

What? There are no such things as criminal hate speech or am I misunderstanding 1A?

Re: New laws trying to criminalize filming cops

#237

Post by dawnbreez »

dcow wrote: post #208
OGWhales wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cops have always been triggered by the mildest of disrespect, this has nothing to do with people worrying about social micro-aggressions. What’s actually happening is that cops are being filmed and because of that people are losing respect for them faster than ever and the cops hate it and want to do anything they can to prevent people from disrespecting them.

SJWs have always been triggered by the mildest of disrespect, which is why we’re here in the first place.

I feel like having video evidence of a police officer doing something they really shouldn't is neither "mild" nor "disrespect" (although, I guess you could argue that I rapidly stopped respecting the police when I realized just how little accountability there is for these incidents...)

Re: New laws trying to criminalize filming cops

#238

Post by zdragnar »

542354234235 wrote: post #136
zdragnar wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Several people have been charged with hate crimes for spinning their car tires over rainbow painted sidewalks, even though nobody else was present. Hate crime is a fucking stupid term; a crime is a crime is a crime. That said, if targeting one group deserves special treatment, then targeting any group should get the same. Equal application of the law, y'know?

>Hate crime is a fucking stupid term; a crime is a crime is a crime. Is a crime a crime? Why are there first degree murder, second degree murder, and voluntary manslaughter? They are all the act of killing someone intentionally, with the only difference being the person's thought process and motivation. Most crimes involve taking into consideration the reasons for the act as part of what makes a crime a crime. So, ha…

That's not what first and second degree murder or manslaughter are. The result is the same for the victim, but the specific actions and intentions are different.

Put another way, why is it better if I murder someone because I hate vegans, or meat eaters, or poor people, or rich people, or car drivers or pedestrians than someone of a protected group?

Adding new laws doesn't make them be enforced any better, so I don't buy the "systemic" argument. Either someone is tried and found guilty or not.

Re: New laws trying to criminalize filming cops

#239

Post by valval »

mitt_romney_12 wrote: post #114
rootusrootus wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> From 25 feet, they can’t capture choking sounds or someone crying “I can’t breathe.”" If you really believe that, I recommend going outside and stepping off 25 feet and then trying some smartphone recordings. 25 feet is actually very close. I wouldn't be surprised if cops find it very uncomfortable to have bystanders that close when any kind of violent encounter is in progress. Most people can run that distance in…

> If you really believe that, I recommend going outside and stepping off 25 feet and then trying some smartphone recordings. I recommend you trying that in a high stress situation involving an number of people in close proximity and lots of environmental noise. And then trying to see how that footage would be interpreted by a hostile lawyer in court > I wouldn't be surprised if cops find it very uncomfortable to have…

> I am more concerned about not being assaulted or killed.

Don’t be — you’re safe unless you decide to make 10 of the worst decisions of your life in a row.

Re: New laws trying to criminalize filming cops

#240

Post by valval »

autoexec wrote: post #188
rootusrootus wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> From 25 feet, they can’t capture choking sounds or someone crying “I can’t breathe.”" If you really believe that, I recommend going outside and stepping off 25 feet and then trying some smartphone recordings. 25 feet is actually very close. I wouldn't be surprised if cops find it very uncomfortable to have bystanders that close when any kind of violent encounter is in progress. Most people can run that distance in…

Maybe you should try having one friend stand 25 feet away while another steps on your neck to see if the camera can still make out your pleas for air while 3-8 others are screaming at you to stop resisting. There are already laws to deal with people who interfere with the work of police. These anti-filming laws don't make interfering with police illegal. They only make recording crimes committed by police illegal. Th…

> There's no justification for these anti-filming laws other than allowing police to abuse the public.

There is, and it’s been stated in simple terms multiple times in these comments, as well as the justification for the law. You saying otherwise doesn’t make it untrue that filming police from too close is dangerous and obstructing.

You’re simply talking about a subject you know nothing about either great confidence and guts.

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