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Apple says it'll remove iMessage and FaceTime in UK rather than break encryption

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Re: Apple says it'll remove iMessage and FaceTime in UK rather than break encryption

#261

The UK keeps trying to throw their weight around only to find out they aren’t that big. The CMA with Xbox and now this. They aren’t large enough for Apple and Microsoft to make massive changes just to accommodate a relatively small market.

The UK has been discovering and forgetting that lesson repeatedly since at least the Suez crisis if not earlier.

Re: Apple says it'll remove iMessage and FaceTime in UK rather than break encryption

#262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Make no mistake: if Apple needed to get someone killed, they would. Ok, I'll play along. Suppose Tim Cook wakes up tomorrow and decides for some reason he wants me dead. How exactly does he do it?

SOP is to have a team "suicide" you.

It doesn't even have to be good. It can be a "robbery" where you get professional-grade double-tapped on your front lawn but nothing's taken, or a "suicide" where you hang yourself from a tree whilst simultaneously shotgunning yourself in the chest. The news will just parrot the local cops' PR statement.

Re: Apple says it'll remove iMessage and FaceTime in UK rather than break encryption

#263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've noticed that too and it is super annoying having family in the UK that will only communicate via Whatsapp. Is this because cell providers outside the US charge for SMS? Even the ones who have iPhones end up using it because it is too much of a pain to use separate messaging apps.

It's because SMS is simply inferior to Whatsapp, Messenger, Instagram, Line, kakaotalk, Snapchat, Signal, etc unless you own an iPhone. All of them are cross platform and aren't intentionally broken for people who don't have or use iMessage. I personally avoid giving out my phone number as much as possible as all the other platforms have much better tools for communication, blocking, media, etc.

I've never really understood what people mean by this. For me, iMessage is indistinguishable from SMS, except for the color of the messages, and the fact that I can use iMessage over WiFi.

Re: Apple says it'll remove iMessage and FaceTime in UK rather than break encryption

#264
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be honest that sounds like both an idealised slogan and a sophism empty of logic. Can you expand upon how the advancements in western society since (say) WWII have been neccesarily dependant upon privacy?

> how the advancements in western society since (say) WWII have been neccesarily dependant upon privacy? Alan Turing. Hell, Tim Cook, a gay man who grew up in Alabama. Neither would have survived childhood with their personalities intact had their governments had the access No. 10 Downing demands. Privacy preserves society’s margins. The margins, by definition, are where change—growth—is nurtured.

This is what’s called “anecdotal evidence”.

Re: Apple says it'll remove iMessage and FaceTime in UK rather than break encryption

#265
post #247

Makes me glad that I left the UK. I wonder what happens when all the Conservative Party MPs discover that this sort of legislation means even more of their internal party conversations — currently on WhatsApp but who knows what they'll use next — get leaked?

Nothing. They know, they don't care. It's simple as that. Politicians will flail, but the inner-circle won't even shrug.

The Conservative party is in a nose-dive which will continue to be until the next couple of generations kick the bucket.

Those who are in the their 60's want the UK to be just like it was before EU.

Those who are in their 40's, 50's accept that brexit was a eff'up, many are in denial that it was a bad decision.

The motto is now "we must just get on with it" which is accepted upon them. They have the lifestyle, let the younger suffer.

I'm 34.. no idea what am I suppose to do.

Re: Apple says it'll remove iMessage and FaceTime in UK rather than break encryption

#266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How exactly does he do it? Just imagine this: Tim Cook travel expenses amount to an half a million dollar per year. travel expenses only. A professional hit man costs between 1/100th and 1/33th of that. Tim has to simply give up on a pair of new shoes that year.

I am confused. Are you arguing that this is a thing that happens? If so, I'd like to see any shred of evidence whatsoever. On the other hand, we know that governments do this sort of thing all the time.

> I am confused. Are you arguing that this is a thing that happens?

they simply have better tools than hitmen, but, for example

https://www.businessinsider.in/policy/news/former-ceo-of-ama...

https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/clearly-lasik-co-f...

> we know that governments do this sort of thing all the time.

they also have better tools than hiring hitmen

contract killing is a fraction of all the homicides

OP asked how the multi billionaire CEO of a trillion dollars company could kill someone

He could simply hire an hitman, it would cost him peanuts

If the victim is also using one of the products the company makes, they would also be in possession of all the information an hitman would need to complete his task, no investigation would be necessary

Re: Apple says it'll remove iMessage and FaceTime in UK rather than break encryption

#267
post #236

Stuff like this is why I'm an Apple fanboy. I'm happy to pay a premium and be locked into their walled garden for some things if it means supporting a company that has the power to shift policy in favor of human rights (privacy in this case).

> a company that has the power to shift policy in favor of human rights Well you're _technically_ right; they do indeed have that power. However, it sounds like you're suggesting they are using that power _to_ shift policy in favor of human rights (emphasis is of importance). Whilst I can't prove that their intention has nothing to do with human rights, it's only in the same way that I can't prove the last U.S. invas…

iMessage and FaceTime are large parts of the Apple Ecosystem lock-in. What obvious profit motive (separate from PR) would removing them provide?

Re: Apple says it'll remove iMessage and FaceTime in UK rather than break encryption

#268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Make no mistake: if Apple needed to get someone killed, they would. Ok, I'll play along. Suppose Tim Cook wakes up tomorrow and decides for some reason he wants me dead. How exactly does he do it?

I would assume he brainwashes a male model to kill you. Sorry for the Zoolander reference. I couldn't help it

But why male models?

Re: Apple says it'll remove iMessage and FaceTime in UK rather than break encryption

#269
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not in a society.

Wrong. Society is just a social construct, but your right to independent thought and agency, which is powered by privacy, are fundamental to the human experience.

Having rights is a social construct. Unless you believe in divine order of things. But I suspect there’s nothing in physical reality that requires any rights to be granted to anyone.

Re: Apple says it'll remove iMessage and FaceTime in UK rather than break encryption

#270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Also, is CSAM the motivating factor for UK or do they want backdoor for more general national security surveillance Baroness Beeban Kidron has been lobbying for stringent anti-CSAM measures in tech for years [0]. She's lead a major pressure campaign in the US, Canada, and the UK for years [1]. Her charity 5Rights and WeProtect both have been able to back Labour and the Tories so she's able to lobby across the aisle…

I know I’m from a different culture - but I don’t understand how the UK still has the House of Lords in 2023. It just doesn’t seem aligned with the principles of a republic or democracy to have unelected lifetime members who are able to draft legislation.

The British people broadly agree with you: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reform_of_the_House_of_Lords#O...
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