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Ask HN: Why does Firefox have such a low market share anyways?

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Re: Ask HN: Why does Firefox have such a low market share anyways?

#131

Post by Klonoar »

pwg wrote: post #118
Klonoar wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>No such massive advertising campaign ever existed to try to convince folks to "install Firefox". I know HN tries to resist comments of this nature, but man do I feel old now. Firefox's entire success pretty much owes itself to a campaign like that dating back to the early to mid 2000s. Hell, there was a massive NYTimes ad in 2004! https://blog.mozilla.org/press/2004/12/mozilla-foundation-pl... Edit: "there as" -> "t…

True, there were Firefox advertising campaigns in the past. How many days did that NYTimes ad run? How does that compare in size to Google being able to spend somewhere around ten to twelve years constantly advertising "switch to Chrome" on every google property (search, youtube, mail, etc.)? The massive size of googles advertising to "switch to Chrome" dwarfs all of the Firefox campaigns combined.

You are shifting the goalposts by trying to say it's about scale and reach, but scale and reach in 2004 wasn't the same as what Google has now. Firefox more or less blanketed the web in advertising to get the switch done.

Your point of "Google has a ridiculous playing field advantage" is noted and absolutely true, but you don't need to reach for the factually incorrect "Firefox has not had campaigns for switching" to make it.

Re: Ask HN: Why does Firefox have such a low market share anyways?

#132

Post by thinking001001 »

Simple: Chrome captured the market with a good product, at the right time.

I remember when Chrome was new, and it was fast, and Google had other game-changing products (like email with enormous storage). I was just an average consumer back then, and I went for Chrome.

Then, once you capture enough market share (due to poor competition), people start targeting Chrome as the de facto standard. Throw in Android and you have a browser that the world now depends on. Even Microsoft gave in (with a built in ad-blocker, cause they're bitter about it, too).

Should we all be running a C++ based Javascript interpreter? Absolutely not. But try explaining why to the masses...

Re: Ask HN: Why does Firefox have such a low market share anyways?

#133

Post by habinero »

hamilyon2 wrote: post #128

For me logging into google properties that automagically logged me in the browser was the red line. The last straw. The unthinkable audacity of taking control of my user agent, done in businessy way with a slight innocent smile. Compared to this, even a hundred pockets and PR lapses and 2007 ignored bugs mean very little. I wish safari and firefox all the best in fight for free web.

Of all the things to criticize them for, "a minor decrease in toil" is a weird one.

Re: Ask HN: Why does Firefox have such a low market share anyways?

#134

Post by genocidicbunny »

I think in part it's because the web also just got shittier.

One of the common reasons given in this thread is that Chrome is faster, but I've found that aggressive use of NoScript and uBlock will make Firefox much faster than your stock Chrome browser. Excessive JS, excessive CSS, and of course the browser made by a company that pushes both excesses is better at handling them.

Re: Ask HN: Why does Firefox have such a low market share anyways?

#135

Post by kehrin »

wintorez wrote: post #17

I was an avid Firefox user, until it started adding services that I never asked for, namely Pocket. Things that should have been an add-on were now a core feature of the product.

I think about a year ago they toned down pockets presence. It's basically just another extension now.

Re: Ask HN: Why does Firefox have such a low market share anyways?

#136

Post by gloryjulio »

damnesian wrote: post #82
thesuitonym wrote: post #15

Good points have already been raised, but don't neglect the rise of smartphones. When you get a Google phone that already has Google's browser installed, and it works relatively well, why would you change? Add Chromebooks into the mix, and those meet a lot of people's needs, why change? Then, if you get a laptop, you'll want to have all of your passwords and bookmarks synced, so instead of using Edge, you grab Chrome…

I am a developer on a team of developers for a large data and interaction-rich website and we've watched the stats morph over the past 8 years from 23% mobile to 23% desktop. It's been a very swift revolution. I do a lot of QA on my phone now. I have been a Firefox proponent for at least ten years and resolved to do most of my QA on FF since I was most familiar with its features. Something that is very irksome about…

How could u not know that all ios browsers are just reskins of Safari if u r a developer? So ios devices are not even in the discussion

Re: Ask HN: Why does Firefox have such a low market share anyways?

#137

Post by bawolff »

Because firefox let itself be defined by its competition (chrome).

Everything in firefox in the last 10 years feels like they are just copying chrome with a bit of a delay. You don't win the market by doing the same thing as the market leader (Especially when the market leader is as well funded as google). You need to find a niche and execute on that.

Re: Ask HN: Why does Firefox have such a low market share anyways?

#138

Post by Shorel »

pwg wrote: post #2

One of the reasons: Massive advertising by Google to convince people to "try chrome". It is only relatively recently that visiting a google property was not met with: "Google X is best used in Chrome -- install Chrome now." (with "install chrome" being a link to the installer. No such massive advertising campaign ever existed to try to convince folks to "install Firefox".

So, the only way to grow Firefox now is to have a website Google can't hijack to advertise Chrome, and also a website everyone wants to use.

"ChatGPT runs better in Firefox. Click here to install it."

Re: Ask HN: Why does Firefox have such a low market share anyways?

#139

Post by antman »

Because a some years back and for many years it was slower. Chrome came as a default for many devices and many sites css where also optimized for it, and soon other browsers adopted its engine. Firefox had a niche of better browser addons but Mozilla leadership killed it. For mobile it is even more handicapped.

Disclaimer: Longtime FF user who feels like a good friend is gone

Re: Ask HN: Why does Firefox have such a low market share anyways?

#140

Post by nashashmi »

The innovation difference between the browsers is not significant enough to merit a switch.

Commercially supported browsers have a big advantage. I remember google chrome in 1.0 days. And it was terrible. They became great after a while. In the same time, Firefox extensions started needing rewrite.

Now the innovations are happening on both sides. The difference is little to none.

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